Help please - been told we have a leak and and to fix it - not even sure we have one!

fairy2

Okay does this make sense? Our latest water bill suggested that we had a leak somewhere in our water supply (it was 3 times its normal amount for the last 6 months). The water company took 3.5 months to tell us this from the day they realised there was a leak ( I would have thought they had some kind of obligation to tell consumer within a reasonable amount of time). We were asked to ascertain whether the leak was internal or external which involved us causing some internal damage ensuring things were turned off. In our opinion the leak was external (between the internal stopcock and the water meter) and an appropriate person was sent. I assumed to try to find leak and hopefully repair?

He arrived today and looked at water meter. He brought no tracing equipment. He said it would be would be a waste of time trying to locate any leak as the frontage is so deep. He did not even try to locate the pipes (i.e. where they are and the direction they go). He also said that even if the leak could be found and mended then it would not stop another leak developing in another part in the future. He suggested that we pay to have a new water supply fitted (independently) between the water meter and the internal stop !!!!. This would involve us getting about 130 foot of pipe laid and having it put AROUND the property and in at the back and not under the property as it would be difficult to put a pipe under concrete floors etc. He said any plumber could do this.

Is this right? There was no attempt to locate any leak just them turning up saying yes you have a problem and over to you.

What is the point of asking me to locate whether it was an internal or external leak if there was not going to be any attempt to locate it?

Surely this sort of work would be very specialised - no normal plumber could do this? who would do all the locating of other services?

Apparently we have 2 weeks to initiate work!

While we have limited insurance to trace a leak we have no insurance just to choose to put a new water supply in (kind of looks like us choosing to improve not repair)? It would involve locating (cost of various surveys) checking and risking damaging drains, electricity and gas cables - in the ground - this is not a small job!!

Any thoughts?Is the water authority not under any obligation in this situation? Have we been treated properly?

Many thanks.

keystone

Unfortunately once the water supply pipe is on your land and to all intents and purposes that means everything your side of the meter even if there is just a couple of feet on the public highway then its your responsbility not the water company's. No different for you than "n" million other householders in the country.

He is right that there is no point actually tracing the leak as if it's ancient lead pipework then once it starts in one place then you will get others too. Indeed to do so would be more expensive as they would have to dig up the whole lot. Give that they have little idea where it lies on your property thats going to be an awful lot of excavation. Their normal method of replacement these days is by moling (does involve small pits though) rather than trenching if you ask them to do it but I guess your or your plumber would trench as not having the specialised moling equipment. Although it does seem that perhaps he was a little uncaring in the way he expressed himself - remembering of course that he's having this same conversation several times week - you are being treated correctly - its your pipe not theirs.

I think I would question the two weeks though if I were you. Thames Water on their own were losing 900,000 litres of potable water a day through leakage and although they've now got it down to around 750,000 its still an awful lot to lose. An artificial timescale seems a tad unfair - but its only initiating action rather than actually doing it I suppose. Remember thats whilst it continues to leak your water bill will not go down.

Not going to cost pennies to fix either. Sorry.

Cheers

Edit: Surveys are a waste of time and money. No utility knows exactly where everything is. You just have to get on with it and be careful as you go. Yes its not a small job but it really isn't a big one either.

fairy2

Thanks so much for your helpful post. Our issue is that trace leak in supply pipes is covered by our insurance installing new supply pipe is not

mart.vader

Which water co is it ?

Cardew

fairy2 wrote: »

Thanks so much for your helpful post. Our issue is that trace leak in supply pipes is covered by our insurance installing new supply pipe is not

Trace leak only, or trace and fix?

If the pipe runs under the house, and the leak is there, what then?

Post above is 100% correct.

fairy2

Affinity water.

"We will pay the costs incurred to find the point of escape of:
(a) a domestic heating oil leak within your home, or a water leak from your permanent internal plumbing or heating system, which is likely to cause insured damage to the buildings or contents;
(b) a water leak from the underground service pipes for which you are legally responsible outside the home but at the address shown in the schedule.
The most we will pay is £10,000 but not more than £2,500 for a water leak outside the home."

I suspect the fix is not covered but the trace is? Makes little sense to me. Do not know if it means they will not fix the leak but will fix the damage which is caused by tracing the leak or not. e.g. make good a forecourt that will need to be dug up.

Also since the supply pipes will run under our home one side unsure which category they would fit in and whether it would then be £2.5 or £10k cover or if it would be covered at all.

keystone

Another Insurance Company waste of space bit of "cover". Tracing quickly become irrelevant in the greater scheme of things when, in the case of a supply pipe, its easier, quicker and cheaper to bypass the leaking pipe altogether and just abandon it in the ground. So their liability under the policy is actually pretty close to zero whilst still attracting an extra premium.

If the new pipe is moled in there should be no damage to your driveway or whatever - they just go under it.

Cheers

fairy2

oh dear - you would weep if you knew how much this insurance cost! actually that should properly read - I will weep!

matelodave

Have you tried phoning the insurance co. We've just had a leak in our outside supply pipe between the meter and our internal stopcock (August this year).

A short phone call to Aviva (our insurance) confirmed that not only was it covered but so was re-instatement of our block paved drive - all we had to do was pay the £200 excess. I have to say that our insurance policy was just as ambiguous and woolly as yours so I did start my phone conversation with Aviva by telling them that I wasn't claiming but just confirming what my insurance covered - once confirmed I made the claim

A man came, tried to trace it, couldn't so dug a couple of holes, found it, fixed it put it all back to rights and you can't now tell where he's been.

Anglian Water requested me to send them two readings, two weeks apart after the repair so that they could estimate how much water had been lost and have credited me with £108 worth of lost water so, apart from being £200 worse off, we are quite happy.

As I do check the meter on odd occasions I identified myself that we had a leak and could make my own estimate of what had been lost which was very close to what AW have compensated me for.

I now read it at least monthly although I'm fairly confident that it was a one off (building brick rubble on supply pipe when the place was built in 1986 caused a hairline crack) although I don't know why it suddenly let go after all that time.

The way to confirm if you've got a leak is to shut off the inside stopcock and then check the meter, if it's still running, turn off the meter stop !!!! and if it stops then you've got a leak or the water is going somewhere else. Meters are quite sensitive and can record down to a litre so even a small leak can be indicated.

mart.vader

I see you're with Affinity Water.

Most of the Water Cos have a scheme for subsidised repair or replacement of leaking water pipes.

I've looked through Affinity's website and I can't see that they do this though. Or that they will give you a leak allowance for water lost via the leak.

matelodave

When I discovered my leak I did ask Anglian Water about options for repair but they said that as it was on my property it was my responsibility to get it fixed and that I had 30 days to get it done.

Otherwise they would either start the "Defective Water Fittings" enforcement process under sections75(2) and 170 of the Water Industry Act and they would take some or all of the following steps

a) carry out the work themselves and recover the cost from me
or
b) Prosecute me under the Water Industry Act 1991 section 73 for allowing my water fittings to be or remain in a defective condition. The maximum fine is £1000.

Not everso helpful, but it does means that you can't muck about too long just in case they send the boys round to do the work and present you with a ginormous bill.