Cocktail Dress

HPoirot

lostinrates wrote: »

Its quite 'modern' and happens a bit (we get loads of invites, we just rarely accept any of them these days!) I think for men who work in lounge suits (which is what I'd think of rather than morning suit in the evening!) and care more about how they look in a metro sexual world and have less opportunity to put on dinner jackets its all quite fun for them, and nice for us to get our male partners in black tie.

That's why the invite has to specify cocktail dress with the black tie. .

Eta....DH no longer wears a suit most days, so just seeing him ina suit is a treat, and this year we did an evening wear cull and our scarecrow wore an old evening suit...with a very inappropriate normal shirt (mulberry) with the collars and cuffs gone, and .......no tie. (We ties a ribbon around his neck).

Obviously the conflict of attire was too much for a female scarecrow to get her head around as he stood alone all summer. . Illustrating what ignoring dress codes will do for your social standing

:rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:
I do hope the hedge being trimmed appreciates the intricacies of your own dress code though :rotfl: x

mountainofdebt

Spendless wrote: »

.

No 'big-wigs' will be looking down their nose at anyone. Husband's employer is still independently owned by the people who set up the business from scratch many years ago. In the early days they had to work a 2nd job on an evening (without me saying what it was think along the lines of cleaner/waiter/delivery driver/bar-man) just to get the company off the ground and they haven't forgotten their roots.

I have no idea why the invite says 'jacket and ties' for the other night. The employer is connected to the Engineering industry and I am wondering if it's because some invited work in a more manual role and it's a way of saying 'no jeans'.

Spendless - please don't think I was being rude about the bigwigs comment......its just I've been to places where if you aren't wearing the correct attire (you'll never believe that grown men could be so frightened of taking off their jacket in sweltering heat just because its not the 'done' thing) nothing is said but its all noted - if that makes sense.

Personally I think the 'jacket and ties' comment is to let you know what sort of clothing is expected - it sounds as if the jacket and tie evening is less formal than the dinner jacket evening but not so informal that jeans would be acceptable

[Deleted User]

lostinrates wrote: »

I have no reference handy, but.....I disagree from experience. . I hesitate to disagree with the OED, and an etiquette guide though. So I am happy to be corrected and find that my experience is wrong. Though it brings the standard of evening wear in uk into an even more sorry for itself situation

In a post further back I actually mentioned that what often gets worn to 'balls' is sorry for itself cocktail , and I stand by that. (And part of why I don't bother with our parish or local hunt ball....:o though there are plenty of other reasons).

Cocktail dresses were originally worn for the 'cocktail parties' that became more popular as the 20th century went on, it was a step down from full evening wear as the parties usually happened before dinner or evening balls and were of shorter duration

Debrett's: Black Tie "For ladies, a smart dress (such as a cocktail dress) is appropriate. It can be long or short, as long as it's not too short. It need not be black."

'Cocktail dress' can also refer to a smart dress at or around knee-length as does 'tea dress' to something between knee and ankle. It's often used in wedding catalogues to refer to length rather than style.

But for balls and white tie I think a full-length gown is gorgeous (and obligatory!)

lostinrates

joolzred wrote: »

Cocktail dresses were originally worn for the 'cocktail parties' that became more popular as the 20th century went on, it was a step down from full evening wear as the parties usually happened before dinner or evening balls and were of shorter duration

Debrett's: Black Tie "For ladies, a smart dress (such as a cocktail dress) is appropriate. It can be long or short, as long as it's not too short. It need not be black."

'Cocktail dress' can also refer to a smart dress at or around knee-length as does 'tea dress' to something between knee and ankle. It's often used in wedding catalogues to refer to length rather than style.

But for balls and white tie I think a full-length gown is gorgeous (and obligatory!)

Thanks, this is pretty much how I see it. Phew. At least I agree with debretts. Not that I care that much.

lostinrates

HPoirot wrote: »

:rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:
I do hope the hedge being trimmed appreciates the intricacies of your own dress code though :rotfl: x

Really, I think you've gone a tad far.....the hedge is a collection of plants and probably isn't interested in my clothes. Really.

The little fluffy white bantams, the peacock, the ponies and the passers by all seem to take express interest.

( my cats prefe long gowns so they can hide under the hem and jump out at people but the dogs have no interest whatsoever in fashion apart from their coats, collars and leads.)

Spendless

mountainofdebt wrote: »

Spendless - please don't think I was being rude about the bigwigs comment......its just I've been to places where if you aren't wearing the correct attire (you'll never believe that grown men could be so frightened of taking off their jacket in sweltering heat just because its not the 'done' thing) nothing is said but its all noted - if that makes sense.

Personally I think the 'jacket and ties' comment is to let you know what sort of clothing is expected - it sounds as if the jacket and tie evening is less formal than the dinner jacket evening but not so informal that jeans would be acceptable

No offence was taken.:) But I wanted to clarify there would be no 'you're wearing the wrong attire' attitudes said or even thought. It's not that type of workplace. Think rags to riches genuinely rather than 'pretending to be one of the boys whilst hiding my Eton background'

The comments about the cocktail party have made me wonder though, because the event that requires the 'cocktail dress' is listed as a champagne reception, followed by Gala dinner then disco and bar. So do I need something 'fancier'? It doesn't matter if I do, what I have wasn't expensive (it's not the dress in the simplybe link, I can't find mine on-line, it's just a similar style) and I'd just switch it to wear for the 'jacket and tie' evening.

adouglasmhor

Lunar_Eclipse wrote: »

A long dress. Not a ballgown, but definitely a long dress by definition and certainly if it's accompanying black tie for a supposedly formal occasion.

In reality, some women will wear shorter dresses, but a cocktail dress is supposed to be a full length dress.

No no no no no.
It did mean that in the 1940s and early 50s though.
It usually means below the knee or longer now.

adouglasmhor

Lunar_Eclipse wrote: »

I checked, to see if my thinking was correct. According to our Oxford English dictionary and social etiquette guide: one said a long evening dress worn to formal occasions and the other said long, often touching the ankle. Admittedly one of them also mentioned shorter dresses may sometimes be worn for semi-formal occasions.

Black tie is semi-formal if it was formal it would be white tie.

hazyjo

Just to let you know, there are some great 'black tie' suits, etc in Matalan. Well worth a look - don't dismiss until you've seen.

If you're a fairly standard size, don't forget ebay. I often have black tie/ballgown christmas dos at work. Bought three GORGEOUS dresses (I'm a size 18 and 5'2" who can rarely find anything to fit in the shops!) off ebay, one of which I wore to a work do and got very favourable comments! I love it! Lent it to a friend recently for a posh do and she got tonnes of praise too. Often pricey stuff you otherwise wouldn't have afforded or wanted to spend the dosh on - all of mine would have cost me a small fortune!

Jx

lazer

To me a cocktail dress is very dressy, something you can't waer for most social occassions.

http://www.debenhams.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/prod_10701_10001_008010818542_-1

http://www.debenhams.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/prod_10701_10001_008010111237_-1

IMO it should be below the knee

Strapless is also fine - altough personally I don't like strapless dress - they don't suit me, and for a formal event, should be worn with a shawl or shrug of some description