Do School Trip Fees subsidise non-payers?

ska_lover

I have just literally laughed out loud at people contradicting themselves

'The holier than thou' brigade bragging about saving their child benefit for school trips...rather than providing for their children with ''handouts''. Seriously THAT is so contradictory.

I will say something rather flammable now ..........Child benefit IS a hand out...you don't work to earn it, it is given to you out of the tax payers purse to fund your choice of producing offspring.

Why should the entire childless population of society pay for your kids to go on school trips? (or whatever people need to spend their child benefit on) Having children is a life choice, so why should people who choose not to have children, fund your life choices? The only way to avoid partly supporting your children on hand outs is to refuse child benefit - if you feel the need to live without handouts, that is.

The reason why child benefit is in place - is for the greater good (a phrase I have nicked from an earlier poster, the greater good, I like it) but we are all a society interlinked in helping each other out. Some need it more than others..some of us have been there, and some of us are lucky enough not to have been.

jalestine

Lol - I don't think the OP intended to incite a welfare state debate (!) She just wanted to know whether the trip fee was a reflection of the true cost of one child on a school trip.

My view is that poverty isn't a crime. On the flipside, we all know ppl whose priorities inc. latest flat screen tv, cigarettes, laptops/mobiles/trainers for their kids under 9yrs old, etc., yet they claim to be skint. Ultimately, ppl are free to choose how to spend their wages/benefits. The alternative would be vouchers to steer everyone's behaviour.

On a sep note, I remember when I was 10 and didn't want to go on a residential trip. The head spoke to me and another boy after school for a minute, saying that if it's to do with the cost, they can help. Actually, it wasn't the cost, I was just scared to go, but it was such a lovely moment of being included, I announced to my mum I would go after all. It was a Catholic school, so they probs had money from the Church in cases of those who had trouble paying, or maybe the Church was subsidising the total cost, as it wasn't much.

Well, something positive about Catholics and school children, for a change.

Don't know wot my point is...maybe that children will remember being ex/included.

nodiscount

Nicki wrote: »

A crap parent who would refuse to pay for a school trip when they can afford to do so, is unlikely I would suggest to give a flying stuff whether their child is allowed to go on the trip or not. So the one who will suffer in those circumstances is only the child, not the parent.

A parent whether on FSM or not, who just cannot find £8 for the trip will care if their child is singled out, as will the child but can do nothing about it.

In both cases the only person to suffer is the child.

I personally don't mind paying what is requested for the school trip and just mind my own business as to what others do. I would not see ANY child, whatever the parent is like, singled out and left behind from a trip. What a completely shameful thing for some of you to suggest should be done to a primary school aged child as a result of something outside their control.

Am wondering whether some on this thread think that the FSM children in their school should wear a different coloured uniform, and those with flaky parents perhaps a badge saying "my parents don't rate me much" just in case their classmates have up until now missed the point that they are not as fortunate as other kids?

How very charitable.
But where do you draw the line? And what kind of message does it send children if you get the same as those whose parents actually make an effort? Isn't there a danger the child will grow up and think 'I don't need to make an effort because people will feel sorry for me and give me the same and those who do make as effort'?

Those who are in genuine need should get help but it shouldn't become a habit. Schools who offer a flexible payment plan are doing the best thing.

Person_one

The message it sends is "Somebody gives a damn about you, and wants the best for you, even if your parents don't."

That's all, and its a good message.

supersaver2

nodiscount wrote: »

How very charitable.
But where do you draw the line? And what kind of message does it send children if you get the same as those whose parents actually make an effort? Isn't there a danger the child will grow up and think 'I don't need to make an effort because people will feel sorry for me and give me the same and those who do make as effort'?

Those who are in genuine need should get help but it shouldn't become a habit. Schools who offer a flexible payment plan are doing the best thing.

A sensible post! It is indeed a valuable lesson to teach children, but it seems now a days that everybody has to have the same whether its worked for or not. I do agree entirely with the flexible payment plan and I'm sure most schools offer this. Benefits for adults on low/no incomes are generous enough in this country to enable a parent to put aside the odd pound a week to cover these expenses.

Shassa

Getting back to Voluntary Contributions and Remissions, this is taken from the Teaching Expertise Website:

Voluntary contributions

Where charges may not be levied, the school can invite parents to make voluntary contributions. Letters to parents inviting voluntary contributions must make it clear that there is no obligation to contribute. Any pupils involved in a trip must be allowed to participate whether or not their parents have made a voluntary contribution.

Remission arrangements

Parents in receipt of income support, family credit, jobseekers’ allowance or disability working allowance should not be charged. Those parents must receive full remission of board and lodging charges where the activity takes place out of school hours or the activity is necessary for a prescribed public examination or the National Curriculum. Under no circumstances can the cost of remission be recovered by charging other pupils more.

Janepig

This is why there will never be a sensible debate about "benefits" in this country. Anyone whose opinion is anything other than one of dishing money out hand over fist with no thought behind it is deemed to be some sort of evil dictator who would rather see primary school aged children shunned and ostracised. Why, maybe we should even stop educating the children of benefit claimants!!

In an ideal world, what person one says about the message a child would get from being funded for something when their parent can't/won't pay is that someone somewhere cares about them even if their parent doesn't would be what gets through, but in the world I see (and unfortunately I do see the very worst of how people are) that certainly wouldn't be the message, and the message that gets through is more likely to be why work for it when someone will bail you out anyway.

It's a situation with no answer really - no-one wants to see kids missing out, but no-one wants to see people taking the mick.

Jx

Toto

Regardless of what we feel about benefits, the one place where this should not be an issue is in schools. Kids have enough to deal with just finding their own place in the world and how that fits with their peers. They have absolutely no control what so ever over what their parents earn or what they do with the money, nor do they have any control over what benefits the government deem to be appropriate for the family.

So regardless of how the school recoup the money, trips should be for everyone.

piglet25

All these comments directed at parents who receive Free School Meals are uncalled for, and is the reason why lots of people who are entitled to them won't claim them because they will get stereotyped and looked down on.
People on benefits don't have a massive disposable income, and with the vast majority of people thinking they are dossing scroungers it can't be much fun. There will always be the exception, but a large number of people are seeking to improve their situation, and I don't see how catting about their children getting a free meal or a funded trip is going to help anyone. If someone objects so strongly about it, don't pay for your own child and let them miss the trip, then they will at least be able to empathise with the child whose parents couldn't afford to send them.

squashy

I'm a primary school bursar. We don't surcharge paying parents to "cover our losses". Neither do we grill or even note down the names of any child that hasn't paid. If the trip runs at a significant cost to the school then we would probably not run that particular trip again.