Completion of the SDLT Return

Leodogger

Richard_Webster wrote: »

If you are having a mortgage your solicitor has to make sure the SDLT return is submitted on time and therefore I can't see how they can allow you to do it.

To explain:

1.Lender requires its mortgage is registered against title.
2. Buyer's solicitor does search at Land Registry which shows whether anything nasty has happened (in which case buyer's solicitor won't complete unless seller sorts it - very rare) but normally will show no new entries and give a priority period during which the purchase and mortgage can registered in priority to anything else - e.g seller in financial trouble and bank decides to register a charge - they have to wait until the end of the priority period and if by then the buyer has been registered they are too late!
3.Cannot register unless SDLT certificate provided following submission of return.

Therefore I cannot see how any sensible solicitor would allow his buyer client to complete the return because he could not make sure he complied with his duties to the mortgage lender to secure the registration.

Of course, as I have said many times before, I do not think it is right to charge separately for this as the implication is that it is some kind of optional extra rather than a key part of a purchase transaction.

If you read my previous posts, we do not need a mortgage, we are paying cash funded by our sale and savings so the above does not apply.

Also my sister completed her own return and she DOES have a mortgage which was transferred when she moved house, so I don't think this is really relevant.

krispy444

Even if you don't need a mortgage a priority search would be done to protect you so the land registry application would still need to be sent to the land registry during the priority period with the SDLT. At the end of the day it's your choice the risk is yours

Leodogger

krispy444 wrote: »

Even if you don't need a mortgage a priority search would be done to protect you so the land registry application would still need to be sent to the land registry during the priority period with the SDLT. At the end of the day it's your choice the risk is yours

You make it sound like the kiss of death ! My sister seemed to manage OK, no reason why I won't is there or are you trying to drum up business for solicitors ?:)

Leodogger

krispy444 wrote: »

Even if you don't need a mortgage a priority search would be done to protect you so the land registry application would still need to be sent to the land registry during the priority period with the SDLT. At the end of the day it's your choice the risk is yours

By the way my sister said her solicitor was OK with her filling the SDLT Return in and told her to return it to her (the solicitor) for onward registry with the Land Registry Office so it wasn't a case of "on your own head be it" as long as she returned the form promptly to the solicitor.

At the end of the day, we PAY solicitors to ensure the property transaction goes smoothly, that doesn't include trying to throw obstacles in our way just because we deny them the chance to earn a bit extra or would they rather lose the business altogether if a person can't afford the extra £75 ? !!

G_M

It goes without saying that if the buyer does his own SDLT return, he must do so in the required timeframes.

Both the HMRC 30 days, and the Priority Search Period.

But this is not rocket science! Most of the form can be filled in before Completion, in preparation, so even allowing for a novice taking longer than a solicitor, and perhaps needing to get advice on a couple of questions on the form, there is no reason it can't be sent off within a few days of Completion!

Richard's point about a solicitor acting for the mortgage lender (not applicable here) is a good one, though I suspect that in the case of those conveyancers who make SDLT form completion an optional 'extra' on their fees they can hardly demand the client leave it to them.

Either it is a mandatory part of their job (and therefore included in their basic fee) OR it is optional, with an extra fee if the buyer asks them to do it. They can't have their cake and eat it!

Leodogger

G_M wrote: »

It goes without saying that if the buyer does his own SDLT return, he must do so in the required timeframes.

Both the HMRC 30 days, and the Priority Search Period.

But this is not rocket science! Most of the form can be filled in before Completion, in preparation, so even allowing for a novice taking longer than a solicitor, and perhaps needing to get advice on a couple of questions on the form, there is no reason it can't be sent off within a few days of Completion!

Richard's point about a solicitor acting for the mortgage lender (not applicable here) is a good one, though I suspect that in the case of those conveyancers who make SDLT form completion an optional 'extra' on their fees they can hardly demand the client leave it to them.

Either it is a mandatory part of their job (and therefore included in their basic fee) OR it is optional, with an extra fee if the buyer asks them to do it. They can't have their cake and eat it!

Couldn't agree more ! :T When it is an essential part of the conveyancing work it should be included as standard if they are quoting to someone who needs a mortgage, after all many companies on the comparison web sites ask upfront if you need a mortgage so it goes without saying that the completion of this form should be included in the standard legal fee if you do, it is not optional, though as you say, they can't force you to let them complete it.;)

Richard_Webster

Richard's point about a solicitor acting for the mortgage lender (not applicable here) is a good one, though I suspect that in the case of those conveyancers who make SDLT form completion an optional 'extra' on their fees they can hardly demand the client leave it to them.

Either it is a mandatory part of their job (and therefore included in their basic fee) OR it is optional, with an extra fee if the buyer asks them to do it. They can't have their cake and eat it!

This is completely logical. I suspect that some firms will be quietly cross that the client has decided to complete his own form - but following their own logic, why shouldn't he if he is a cash buyer?

If their Ts & Cs imply that the client can do it himself even if there is a mortgage then the solicitor has to make sure the form is completed submitted and the certificate obtained and sent to them in plenty of time so they can submit the Land Registry Application within the priority period. The hassle involved with this is likely to take up much more time than the solicitor completed the form himself and din't charge!

Unfortunately the form itself has a number of questions in it that could easily be misunderstood and answered wrongly. HMRC's helpline is difficult to get through to, so a lot of people will find it hard to do it.

Leodogger

Richard_Webster wrote: »

This is completely logical. I suspect that some firms will be quietly cross that the client has decided to complete his own form - but following their own logic, why shouldn't he if he is a cash buyer?

If their Ts & Cs imply that the client can do it himself even if there is a mortgage then the solicitor has to make sure the form is completed submitted and the certificate obtained and sent to them in plenty of time so they can submit the Land Registry Application within the priority period. The hassle involved with this is likely to take up much more time than the solicitor completed the form himself and din't charge!

Unfortunately the form itself has a number of questions in it that could easily be misunderstood and answered wrongly. HMRC's helpline is difficult to get through to, so a lot of people will find it hard to do it.

Couldn't agree more. I have just had an email from my solicitor who is a little put out I think from the tone, that we are saying we want to complete it ourselves. She at first intimated that it was down to us to get the forms from HMRC, complete them and get the certificate once received back to her in time to submit it to the Land Registry, even though on the SDLT Return information sheet there is a tick box which states that we can opt to complete it ourselves when we have received it from her and then return it to her (as the agent) and it will then be submitted for registry to the Land Registry.

When I pointed out the fact that the forms should come from her, she (sulking I think) said she would send them to us when received from HMRC but we would not get any help from her in filling it out because they (the solicitors) are not covered by insurance (whatever that means) to help with the form and it would be down to us to get it back in time. My response is that a solicitor is supposed to ensure that she gets the transaction completed on time NO MATTER WHO fills out the forms and as long as we complete and return promply which we can do as we live just down the road from her office, then there should be no problem !;)

Seabee42

My conveyancer wanted to charge me £90+ VAT for the completion of the form so I looked into doing it myself.

HMRC website implies you can register and submit the form online but sadly this option is not open to individuals. You can however request the form SDLT1 (check the guide to make sure you dont need SDLT2-4 (more than 2 people buying and stuff like that) from HMRC. It took a week to arrive. You will need to use HMRC guidebook to look up some codes they use for instance they code which council it come under. You will also need the title deeds to put in the house reference number as well.

Sadly due to the Mortgage requirements as stated above (they have to get it updated within 30 days) my conveyancer would not let me fill it in and pay the money accross myself. As I had already completed it on paper I sent them the completed version and refused to pay for it, which eventually they agreed as they had told me I could do it myself in writing!

There are a couple of threads on here I used one had the sample form (so I knew what information I had to get) and the other had a link to HMRC form ordering website!

Leodogger

Seabee42 wrote: »

My conveyancer wanted to charge me £90+ VAT for the completion of the form so I looked into doing it myself.

HMRC website implies you can register and submit the form online but sadly this option is not open to individuals. You can however request the form SDLT1 (check the guide to make sure you dont need SDLT2-4 (more than 2 people buying and stuff like that) from HMRC. It took a week to arrive. You will need to use HMRC guidebook to look up some codes they use for instance they code which council it come under. You will also need the title deeds to put in the house reference number as well.

Sadly due to the Mortgage requirements as stated above (they have to get it updated within 30 days) my conveyancer would not let me fill it in and pay the money accross myself. As I had already completed it on paper I sent them the completed version and refused to pay for it, which eventually they agreed as they had told me I could do it myself in writing!

There are a couple of threads on here I used one had the sample form (so I knew what information I had to get) and the other had a link to HMRC form ordering website!

That thread on how to fill it in would be helpful if I can find it We hold the title deeds here as our last property purchase was cash so probably have the reference number on there if I can find it. We don't need a mortgage so it should be straight forward.

I am just a little annoyed that the solicitor seems to be happy for us to flounder (admitting that she will not help us with the odd question), trying to make it sound too difficult for us to do ourselves even though she will get her fee for the transaction and is responsible for making sure it completes on time !

Very unhelpful attitude in my opinion and in any other service sector would not be tolerated. They just seem to think they are indispensable. :mad: At the end of the day you are paying a solicitor to act as the agent to purchase a whole property, not half a one. If you were putting your car through an MOT you would not expect to be charged extra for testing the brakes or for issuing the MOT when the MOT could not be granted without it being done.