Direct debit reinstated without my permission

thegfb

Hi,

Not sure if this is the correct forum but here goes:

I applied for a mortgage in March this year through a local Countrywide broker (never again!). The mortgage all went through fine and we completed in June.

During the process the broker recommended lots of insurances that I didn't really feel we needed but my mrs just said accept them all until the mortgage had been completed then cancel them as she felt that if we started saying we didn't want them then the broker might not be so proactive with getting the actual mortgage. She is a worrier so I just acquiesed. There was a contents/building insurance policy and a mortgage protection policy.

Anyway, when we exchanged contracts around the 20th June I immediately took out another buildings insurance policy to comply with lending conditions (6 times cheaper than what he currently had with even better cover!) and wrote a letter cancelling all the insurance policies. I specifically stated "cancel from 21st June or whenever this letter is received" and posted it first class. I asked for written confirmation that the instruction had been carried out. I then cancelled the directed debits as although the policies had been paid partly in arrears and partly in advance, I calculated that we would be owed money back rather than owe more.

A couple of days later I received a few missed calls from a number I recognised as Countrywide, I just ignored them as my experience of dealing with banks and PPI means I want everything in writing. Little more, until a week or so later I had an email from Countryside customer services telling me that they couldn't collect the direct debits. I replied immediately telling them that I had cancelled the policy in writing and cancelled the direct debits. Nothing else heard!

Fast forward to 2nd September some two months later and they have created a new direct debit and taken nearly £13 from my account?? Anyway, phoned the bank immediately and got them to cancel it. I sent an email to Countrywide headed "complaint" and told them I'd cancelled and they had no right to do what they did, especially with nothing in writing beforehand to let me know. A few more missed calls from them which I ignored and nothing else. Then I get another email telling me that they cannot collect my direct debit blah blah.

So... where do I stand with this cowboy outfit? Do I have to check my online banking every day just to make sure they aren't taking money from me? How can I enforce the fact that I have cancelled the direct debit and stop them taking money from me? Is it down to my bank? Surely if I actually owed them money they'd send me something in the post as quick as a flash.

For anyone reading this and considering Countrywide - I did finally get my mortgage with them in what are hard times but the broker was useless, he kept losing supporting documentation etc and had no idea what was happening. I played dumb when I went in for appointments as I normally do and the amount of !!!!!!!! he was coming out with was ridiculous. If it wasn't for my ultra-stressed wife who just wanted to stick with him and see it through I'd have been out of the door and speaking to someone else pronto!

InsideInsurance

The insurance would have a cancellation fee and so it is most likely you would owe them if you cancelled outside of the 14 days cooling off period. They can also have a commission clawback clause which will further increase the money you owe.

Most insurers/ brokers terms of business also allows for continuous payment authority etc so that they can retain and reuse payment details. You agree to this when you accept the policy and give your payment details.

Rather than using the head in the sand and pushing everything to writing which takes much longer you would be better off picking up the phone and actually speaking to them to ensure the policy has indeed been cancelled and deal with whatever outstanding fees are due, which may now well include failed payment charges.

thegfb

Thanks for the reply, but I haven't buried my head in the sand at all, in fact I have sent several items of correspondence and none have been replied to, it would appear that it's the organisation that's burying their head in the sand.

grumbler

InsideInsurance wrote: »

The insurance would have a cancellation fee and so it is most likely you would owe them if you cancelled outside of the 14 days cooling off period. They can also have a commission clawback clause which will further increase the money you owe.

Most insurers/ brokers terms of business also allows for continuous payment authority etc so that they can retain and reuse payment details. You agree to this when you accept the policy and give your payment details.

Firstly, the OP was clearly about the DD, not about a CPA - the cancelled DD was reinstated and the money collected by it.

Secondly, whatever rights they apparently have for the money they have no rights to reinstate the DD without the customer's authorization.

@OP - claim the money back from the bank under the DD guarantee. However, if the company can prove that you owe the money you'll have to pay it by other means.

thegfb

Grumbler - thanks for clarifying that. I didn't want to appear rude, but the first reply didn't answer my question and just seemed to leap to the defence of an unhelpful organisation.

I have called the bank and had the DD refunded, I am just concerned that it will keep happening. I have read about CPA before and my understanding is that they are entirely different from DD, thanks for clarifying that I thought I was right

Don't get me wrong - if I rightfully owe money I will pay (I want to pay it so I can be done with this bad experience and forget it!) but if I actually owed money I can't see why it's not in the interests of Countrywide to write and tell me?

Archi_Bald

Surely you got the policy terms of your insurances? What do they say about cancellation?

MPH80

Erm - just a quick thought - what address do they have on file for you?

Sure - they'll have the 'insured' address from the application - but presumably the broker supplied them with your previous address to write to you at?

Is there a postal redirect in place from your previous address? Could their letters be arriving there?

InsideInsurance

grumbler wrote: »

Firstly, the OP was clearly about the DD, not about a CPA - the cancelled DD was reinstated and the money collected by it.

I didnt capitalise or abbreviate it to CPA for the reason that I was not explicitly talking about the credit/ debit card "CPA" scheme

Insurers terms are more general, they will retain payment details and will reuse them to collect monies paid, ie you give them a continuous authority to take payment from them. For bank details this is will naturally be a DD as this is the method for companies to pull money from your account and for credit/ debit/ charge cards it will be a normal charge that should go under a reoccuring merchant ID and CPA.

With an actual CPA you can withdraw your authority to that merchant by contacting your bank/ card issuer.This makes life easy other than not all banks are good at training their staff how to do this.

Cancelling a DD however does not withdraw your authority for the merchant to set up a new DD if the contract that you agreed to did give them permission to reuse the details. Unfortunately with DDs there is no way to block a merchant only individual instructions however unlike CPA you can at least get an immediate refund if you blag a story to your bank (or if indeed it is an error).

Of cause you can keep writing to the broker and hope that they get round to picking it up and dealing with it but the massively quicker method of resolving this is to phone them and if needs be follow that up with a letter to reconfirm what was agreed.

mgdavid

Cannot say I have much sympathy for someone who doesn't answer phone calls even when the number is recognised. Or someone who wastes companies and peoples time taking out insurance policies just for an easy life. Or expects every communication to be done in writing, my father was like that but he died 30 years ago. I think to a large extent you are experiencing the consequences of your own actions, maybe something to ponder upon.

grumbler

InsideInsurance wrote: »

Cancelling a DD however does not withdraw your authority for the merchant to set up a new DD if the contract that you agreed to did give them permission to reuse the details.

Rubbish.
Authorization for setting up a DD is one-off.
I give them permission to keep collecting money by the DD, not to keep reinstating it indefinitely. By doing this they are pooling a fast one knowing that in the worst case scenario the money will be just recalled.

InsideInsurance

grumbler wrote: »

Rubbish.
Authorization for setting up a DD is one-off.

Evidence/ proof?