Share certificate replacement costs. Any tips?

Jonsquestion

I've moved house a few times, and the actual company has changed name too, but I can't seem to find the share certificate for my shares.

The broker wants £91 for a new certificate.

£40 for an "admin fee", for a "letter of indemnity" which surely they'll just produce off a PC.

£51 for a "guarantee", though I don't know what for. They did say I could ask my bank to guarantee it - I haven't asked for a quote yet.

Anyone out there have any tips?

(Edited to remove the exclamation marks. Y'see, I'm learning!)

Glen_Clark

If it was only the cost of printing off the letter they would print one off for everyone who claims to have shares and lost the certificate.
Who do you think should pay for your mistake - the other shareholders?
I suggest you pay up and take proper care of your new certificate.

dunstonh

The broker wants £91 for a new certificate!!!!!

That seems fair enough. You are asking them to do work for your mistake after all.

£40 for an "admin fee", for a "letter of indemnity" they'll produce off a PC.

How much does the computer system cost? How much do the staff cost that run and use it? Pressing a few buttons may be cheap but the cost to get to that point is an issue. Plus, there are regulatory issues and liability that needs to be factored in as well as profit.

If you are not going to cover the cost of administration and liability then who is? Perhaps you will take more care in future.

Jonsquestion

Glen, I can see why you have that D of E award. You seem to have no comprehension of the difference between a shareholder and a broker. The brokers are the one's with the huge bonuses, and who charge £40 for a letter.

If anyone has any advice that's actually helpful I'd be pleased to hear from them. If you're just going to be sanctimonious, please remember that you have no idea of my personal circumstances (ie one of the previous addresses being my father's house, and the fact that we're trying to sort out everything that's there after he passed away).

I'm moving my shares to iWeb, because the likes of Capita and Equiniti charge ridiculous fees for selling shares. iWeb, on the other hand, charge reasonable fees. It's a pity the shares weren't with them in the first place.

It was, in any case, Capita themselves who suggested I might get the guarantee at a better price elsewhere, so I hoped there might be someone on this forum who knew about these things (like an IFA, "dunstonh", but one who actually has some knowledge).

bowlhead99

If the shares had been in any broker's low cost nominee account it would not have been possible to lose them.

If instead you or late father look to avoid ongoing maintenance costs by not paying for ongoing custody and reporting, and looking after things yourself, you have a risk that you won't be able to prove you were ever issued the shares (or that you didn't, for example, give them to another broker who already sold them). That is what the indemnity insurance is for. The extra cash for administration is to cover the time and cost and infrastructure of building these extra services into the business so that it's there when you need it (and you don't pay, if you don't use it).

If you are looking for tips to keep cost down, have you tried going direct to the company registrar of the company concerned? Ultimately a certificate is only evidence of the shares recorded against your name in the shareholders register at the offices of the company.

*edit:
I think we do know the difference between a shareholder and a broker and Glen and Dunstonh are not exceptions. You seem to categorise brokers as "people who make bonuses" and investors as "people who get screwed". The truth is that brokers provide services to customers and customers pay for the services.

Instead of moaning at the advice you received and criticising people for not knowing what brokers are: have you considered that Capita et al are not primarily in the business of providing stockbroking services? Capita registrars provide company admin and registrar services to lots of plcs. They are not known for or ever mentioned here as being primarily stockbrokers. By contrast, Iweb or X-o or any number of cut price execution-only broking services provide mainstream mass market cheap brokerage services if that's what you want. It is not a sensible comparison.

If you ask a mechanic to paint your car he can arrange it but will probably outsource it to a respray shop and charge you for his time in arranging it plus profits plus the outsourcee's profits plus he won't necessarily have picked the most economic service provider in the world in the first place.

Hope this helps.

Jonsquestion

bowlhead99 wrote: »

If the shares had been in any broker's low cost nominee account it would not have been possible to lose them.

If instead you or late father look to avoid ongoing maintenance costs by not paying for ongoing custody and reporting, and looking after things yourself, you have a risk that you won't be able to prove you were ever issued the shares (or that you didn't, for example, give them to another broker who already sold them). That is what the indemnity insurance is for. The extra cash for administration is to cover the time and cost and infrastructure of building these extra services into the business so that it's there when you need it (and you don't pay, if you don't use it).

If you are looking for tips to keep cost down, have you tried going direct to the company registrar of the company concerned? Ultimately a certificate is only evidence of the shares recorded against your name in the shareholders register at the offices of the company.

OK, thanks for the more informed viewpoint. The thing is, my father bought these shares for me many years ago. I'm not sure where the original certificate was, and Dad got a little haphazard in his old age!

But, and this is what irritates me a little, these shares have been registered and recorded on Capita's website for years. It's not as if they're some mystical missing shares. The home address is correct, the details are correct, and the dividends come through to my bank account. They know who I am and what I hold, and have done for quite a long time. Out of all the shares I hold, these are the only ones that (apparently) have a paper certificate.

Anyway, I'll swallow a £40 letter fee if I have to, but I did hope someone would know about the guarantee side of things.

And thanks for the tip about trying the company registrar.

[Deleted User]

Hi,

I would think that Capita is your company registrar, it will tell you on dividends slip.

Jonsquestion

[Deleted User] wrote:

Hi,

I would think that Capita is your company registrar, it will tell you on dividends slip.

I think you might be right

Jonsquestion

bowlhead99 wrote: »

*edit:
I think we do know the difference between a shareholder and a broker and Glen and Dunstonh are not exceptions.....

Instead of moaning at the advice you received and criticising people for not knowing what brokers are: have you considered that Capita et al are not primarily in the business of providing stockbroking services? Capita registrars provide company admin and registrar services to lots of plcs. They are not known for or ever mentioned here as being primarily stockbrokers. By contrast, Iweb or X-o or any number of cut price execution-only broking services provide mainstream mass market cheap brokerage services if that's what you want. It is not a sensible comparison.

Again, thank you for the informed approach. I am willing to be re-educated and you obviously have the knowledge to do that. Your comments are duly noted and my position is somewhat different to when I started the post.

But I will stand by my comments re: Glen and dunstonh. I am not "moaning at the advice you received and criticising people", I am responding to the kind of post they make. They don't give advice, they simply look down on people and make comments that translate to "pay up or shut up".

Perhaps my original opening tag of "rip-off" was harsh, and indeed your helpful posts have changed my mind somewhat. But (and given the "Newbie" tag by my name and the request it attaches) I was looking for advice and instead got the first two posts of criticism. This is why I don't tend to use Forums in general, there are too many people simply fond of their own opinion.

As I have stated, it was Capita themselves who suggested I could look for the guarantee elsewhere to keep costs down, but as yet no-one has actually referred to this aspect.

[Deleted User]

Hi,

well here's what Capita says, here,

and another version, here.

dunstonh

But I will stand by my comments re: Glen and dunstonh. I am not "moaning at the advice you received and criticising people", I am responding to the kind of post they make. They don't give advice, they simply look down on people and make comments that translate to "pay up or shut up".

If you start a unqualified rant then you should expect responses of that nature. The tone is set by the style YOU post.

This is why I don't tend to use Forums in general, there are too many people simply fond of their own opinion.

Yes, people who are fond of their opinion and scream rip off where no such thing exists for example.