Stunning plumber's bill

GwylimT

So the company is based 15 miles down the road, out of business hours you will find that plumbers drive directly from their own homes and have to drop whatever they are doing, having dinner, putting their children to bed, cleaning up etc.

You always pay a premium on a Sunday and you should expect this, I would have thought that virtually all plumbers would each charge for call out out or hours, or charge a mileage rate.

I'm a mechanic and when I worked at a garage we always charged a mileage fee for call outs, we don't get a free supply of time or petrol you know!

doodlesmum

I am married to a plumber and i can see this from both sides so to speak.My other half works with a fellow plumber and they are always on call .If he is rang he will go if it is a call in the middle of the night or a Sunday then he will charge slightly more.We have been in the middle of Christmas dinner at my inlaws and he was called out to an emergency so in respect of this i can see why your plumbers charged more.Plumbers do have families too so if called out outside of normal daytime working hrs i think you are going to find you are more than likely going to be charged more.

southcoastrgi

zigglewigler wrote: »

Yes, I would have left it till next day. But that's not the issue.

Please, if you think £200 for a 1 hour job, even on a Sunday represents value, keep it to yourself.

I will as last resort go to court, the law states charges should be reasonable, and reasonable would be along industry standards, ie every quote I get since, is under £100.

I'm afraid it is very much the issue, you called an emergency plumber on a sunday eve (although you haven't said what time), just try breaking down on the motorway with no cover & phoning the AA or RAC & see how much they charge you just to tow you to the nearest exit

You asked for people's opinions & then you tell us if we don't agree with you to shut up

There is no industry standard for any charges in the construction business so you are on a non starter there, just because you have had quotes from others that means absolutly nothing

Going to court will waste your time & his, plus when you lose (& you will) you will have to pay the orginal invoice, the court costs, interest on the orginal invoice, the time he has had to spend attending court

Dan-Dan

zigglewigler wrote: »

My mother had a water leak on a Sunday evening, called a plumber that is based 20 miles away, via tenant's builder and maintenance firm, the job took 1 hour.

The bill later posted was £200.

It took a few attempts to get them to itemize it.

The justification for this charge, is £60 per hour(Sunday evening), a total of 3 hours, to get to the job and return home, £20 materials for 12" of copper pipe, a little solder, a little gas. Plus VAT.

So they want to charge £120 for travel time! The company is based 15 miles down the road.

It seems like they made up a price. When I asked for a breakdown, they just said that's what it cost. Now that they've supplied an itemized bill, it looks like they're getting 'creative'.

They did say that they haven't even charged the full price!

Other plumbers have given me a quote for the same job, and they do not charge travel time, just the on site job.

What's the best way to tackle these thieves?

Shop around?
Wait till Monday?
Turn stopcock ?
Learn plumbing (or your mum)?


Just pay it and stop complaining so much , £200 is alot less than potential damp ceilings and joists and the like

keystone

Ha Ha. Good job you don't live South of the River then. Certain well know plumbing company operating there sharing their name with a tube station charges £ 150 + VAT per hour from 7am on Sunday to 7pm and then £ 200 per hour after 7 until midnight but at least they put these charges in the public domain.

Both OP and plumber are at fault here. OP for not asking the question before contracting with plumber to come and and plumber for not saying what the charges were likely to be during that telephone call.

Cheers

zigglewigler

HappyMJ wrote: »

What law is that then? It's not that excessive.

My hourly rate is £30 an hour double time on a Sunday evening....15 miles away is a total of 30 miles so add £15 in mileage costs and another hour labour at an average speed of 30 mile an hour so £120 labour is easily justifiable and reasonable...plus £20 in parts plus VAT of 20% and that's a a total of £186...not far off your £200 bill.

If you go to court it will cost you a lot more than £100 in court fees alone.

You need to come to an agreement with the plumber without court being involved if you can.

If you don't pay the plumber will eventually take you to court. In the court response you can offer what you think is fair and reasonable i.e £100. Then it will be up to the plumber to prove that £200 is reasonable....which I don't think will be too hard.

Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations (2008). The plumber didn't declare a call out charge when they had the opportunity, so contravening the law because it was a deliberate attempt to mislead, my mother was told she would just pay for the job.

Average speed between the two locations on a Sunday night is 60mph, main road all the way. So travel time 30 minutes total, but again irrelevant as no call out or travel expenses declared. The reason proper professional plumbers charge up to £80 per hour on a Sunday eve, is so that they can cover the travel time and costs. The £80 isn't just for the extraordinary skills they have to deploy on site.

ALL subsequent quotes from plumbers for the exact same job, come in under £100, so I can easily demonstrate in court if need be, that the charges are unreasonable. The plumber could never justify over £200, when NOBODY else in his same profession would charge over £100. Other than dodgy plumbers who aren't aware of Unfair Trading Regulation LAW.

Look up Legislation gov uk, The Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations 2008.

Newbies can't post links apparently.

zigglewigler

somethingcorporate wrote: »

What law states charges have to be reasonable? If someone is stupid enough to pay it you can bet your bottom dollar someone will be stupid enough to charge it.

You're on to a hiding to nothing here so chalk it up to experience and save your energy, you won't win here.

The Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations 2008, states that call out charges etc., have to be declared upfront, the law doesn't set out what reasonable charges should be, but that they SHOULD be reasonable, ie along industry standards, so if ten plumbers quote under £100, the £200 plus is demonstrably unreasonable in a dispute resolution or court.

Interesting that you say some will charge it, because some will pay it, is that because they too 'save energy' and give in? Like your backbone.

keystone

zigglewigler wrote: »

Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations (2008). The plumber didn't declare a call out charge when they had the opportunity, so contravening the law because it was a deliberate attempt to mislead, my mother was told she would just pay for the job.

The breakdown of the charge that YOU stated further up the thread says nothing about a call-out charge. How can you complain about a callot charge when the breakdown they gave you and you repeated here says nothing about one?

The plumber could never justify over £200, when NOBODY else in his same profession would charge over £100.

"NOBODY" is a gross stretch. I have shown you where there is a plumbing firm that charges £ 200 per hour plus VAT after 7pm on a Sunday night and those prices are clearly stated on the internet. They don't have a call-out charge either and yes I think its obscene but to suggest that noone in the industry does it is plain silly.

IMO Happy's analysis is pretty fair so theres no reason to snipe at him. Also somethingcorporate has a point too whether you agree with him or not (and he and I have been having an interesting "discussion" of late anyway so we are certainly not best buddies) but its unfair of you to challenge him for having no backbone TBH.

And I stand by what I said in post 16 too. There's fault on both sides.

Cheers

southcoastrgi

like myself & others have already, IT DOESN'T MATTER WHAT OTHERS HAVE TOLD YOU THEY WOULD CHARGE, a plumber or plumbing company can charge whatever they want to, yes they should have told you they charged for travel, however they are just going to say in court that they told your mother this on the phone, as you didn't make the call or speak to them anything you say is hearsay & not admissible in court, below is a scale of charges from the biggest co of plumbers in the country so your "no OTHER plumbing co would have charged over £100" would just be laughed out of court


Company Charges





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RatesMon-Fri
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12am-7amPlumbing£80
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zigglewigler

martinsurrey wrote: »

BASED 15 miles down the road, so I assume you think the plumber was sitting in the company office at what ever time on a Sunday!?

you're being charged for the time the plumber took to get from wherever he lives to the job and back again... where the company is based is of zero relevance.

I agree with everyone else, you WILL lose if you take it further, and it WILL cost you more.

next time get quotes and look for a plumber that LIVES close by.

So if the plumber was up in Glasgow with mates, they could charge for the extra time there and back?

Company's base is 100% relevant! If they want to charge £120 travel from wherever, including Timbuktu, they must state upfront, according to The Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations 2008.

The plumber called was the one on contract for repairs to all National Trust properties, in one of which my mother resides, they were given preference since they'd done work before and she thought she could trust them.

They ARE local, non closer out in the sticks, if they have staff that LIVE miles from the company's base(which they don't) they have to declare any extra costs for travel/call out. All set out in The Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations 2008.

And no, I WILL not lose as the law is on my side, despite most people here being ignorant of the law. This is why there are too many shoddy trader practices in this country, because people give in like Tea Drinking Dunkirk Cowards, shrug and say 'oh well, plumbers hey, what chancers, I'll know better next time, better pay up'.

If you can be bothered to read the Unfair Trading Regulations 2008 you might learn that consumers are protected.