The law is a joke and the CPS are useless

skinnylegs3

Mydaughter was arrested last October, accused of obtaining itemsfraudulently. It was her employer whoaccused her. It’s totally untrue and hehas only said it to get back at her because she turned down his advances.

Anyway since then it has been a ridiculoussaga of the case being put in the warned list 4 times and then removed becauseat mention hearings (asked for by her solicitor) the prosecution have beenshown to not disclosing all papers asked for . The employer said he had sacked my daughter (he hadn’t) and proof ofthis was asked for – he originally said he sacked her in a letter then changedit to a text and now says he can’t remember how! Her solicitor requested copies of her workand time sheets and this haven’t beenforthcoming either. Some items they say can’t be found, some they say weregiven to my daughter shortly after her arrest (they weren’t).

At the 3 mention hearings (in front of adifferent judge each time) the judge has expressed annoyance with the CPS fordragging the case out, not providing the papers requested, not tryingthemselves to change the date of the trial seeing as they knew they were notready. One judge said he was tempted togive a stay of execution, one said if the prosecution could not make a casethen the defence could reasonably say they could not defend their clientproperly.

Despite each judges’ annoyancestill they have given the prosecution more time to serve papers, although theynever have. It’s now in the warned listfor mid September . My daughter ismaking herself ill with worry over this and I am scared she will do somethingsilly. I have tried to speak to hersolicitor to see if it is not possible to try and get the case dismissed but hesays the court will not agree to this. So I want to know how long this can drag on for and how come the CPS areallowed to lie, procrastinate and be totally unprofessional. Her solicitor says the CPS may be willing todo a deal if she pleads guilty to a lesser amount but why should she when sheis innocent? It doesn’t even seem as ifher solicitor and barrister are playing fair. This is my first experience of anything to do with the law in thiscountry (hopefully the last too) and I am far from impressed.

paulineb_2

Im really sorry to hear this. My family had a similar issue last year, our issue wasnt with the procurator fiscal, in fact the fiscal was the person who went over and above the call of duty to try and support us. It was with a senior police officer and his behaviour and the actions of one WPC.

All I can say is, I hope you get the outcome you want and that your daughter starts to put her life back together.

paulineb_2

Fiscal is similar to CPS in scotland

aileth

I have no advice, but so sorry for this predicament and all the sympathies for your daughter. I truly hope that the ex-employer hangs himself with his own noose - I wouldn't be surprised if he did. This whole saga might come out with a bittersweet ending for her, I believe karma does exist

Alpha58

Sounds like the ex-employer will be sunk by the web of deceit he seems to be spinning but fully empathise with the position your daughter is in. Hang in there, it will right itself in the end. As for the CPS, if their solicitors were competent they would be working in the real world, not doing it for the comparative pittance that the civil service offer - pay peanuts, get monkeys...

Dunroamin

skinnylegs3 wrote: »

Mydaughter was arrested last October, accused of obtaining itemsfraudulently. It was her employer whoaccused her. It’s totally untrue and hehas only said it to get back at her because she turned down his advances.

Anyway since then it has been a ridiculoussaga of the case being put in the warned list 4 times and then removed becauseat mention hearings (asked for by her solicitor) the prosecution have beenshown to not disclosing all papers asked for . The employer said he had sacked my daughter (he hadn’t) and proof ofthis was asked for – he originally said he sacked her in a letter then changedit to a text and now says he can’t remember how! Her solicitor requested copies of her workand time sheets and this haven’t beenforthcoming either. Some items they say can’t be found, some they say weregiven to my daughter shortly after her arrest (they weren’t).

At the 3 mention hearings (in front of adifferent judge each time) the judge has expressed annoyance with the CPS fordragging the case out, not providing the papers requested, not tryingthemselves to change the date of the trial seeing as they knew they were notready. One judge said he was tempted togive a stay of execution, one said if the prosecution could not make a casethen the defence could reasonably say they could not defend their clientproperly.

Despite each judges’ annoyancestill they have given the prosecution more time to serve papers, although theynever have. It’s now in the warned listfor mid September . My daughter ismaking herself ill with worry over this and I am scared she will do somethingsilly. I have tried to speak to hersolicitor to see if it is not possible to try and get the case dismissed but hesays the court will not agree to this. So I want to know how long this can drag on for and how come the CPS areallowed to lie, procrastinate and be totally unprofessional. Her solicitor says the CPS may be willing todo a deal if she pleads guilty to a lesser amount but why should she when sheis innocent? It doesn’t even seem as ifher solicitor and barrister are playing fair. This is my first experience of anything to do with the law in thiscountry (hopefully the last too) and I am far from impressed.

That's a bit harsh for fraud!

Imp

Sounds like the CPS are being completely professional. They don't have a case, but by stringing it out a bit they might make your daughter confess to a lesser crime. Success all round and bubbly to celebrate.

Lawyers play games. Your daughter is just a pawn.

KME91

Has your daughter looked into making a counter claim against the employer? She should consider seeing an employment law expert solicitor about the way she has been treated, and what has been done to her. It might give her some peace of mind to know she's able to fight back and not just sit and wait for things to happen to her.

geoffky

Your daughters solicitor needs to buck their ideas up...I would of applied for a dismissal..A while ago..

Your daughters solicitor should apply for the case to be thrown out on the next occasion if it is not ready to proceed.

Your daughters solicitor can appeal the refusal of his application (to dismiss the claim) to the crown court.

You need to ask your daughters solicitor the following:
1. If the prosecution are not ready on the next occasion, what do you intend to do as a result?
2. Why can we not apply to dismiss the case if the CPS are not ready to proceed on the 5th occasion?
3. If we apply and the application is refused, what can we do about it?

Yorkie1

geoffky wrote: »

Your daughters solicitor can appeal the refusal of his application (to dismiss the claim) to the crown court.

If it's in the "warned list" for a certain week then it is already at the Crown Court. Mags Ct doesn't do warned lists.

skinnylegs3

Thanks for all the replies.

I rang my daughter's solicitor today as I am very worried about my daughter. She is hardly eating, can't sleep and is very depressed.

Her solicitor said it's not possible to ask for the case to be dismissed. He said this is only possible prior to the plea and case management hearing. He also said the only course of action he can think of is to let the case be called in to the list for trial and if the CPS have not served the necessary information by the date the case is called they will try and get a further adjournment. He could then oppose that which could force the prosecution to withdraw or he could make an application to stay the proceedings as without the documentation, which we have now been waiting months for, my daughter could not have a fair trial.

It seems ridiculous to me that an application to have the case dismissed would have to be before the plea and case management hearing as we did not know then that the CPS would procrastinate for such a long time and either refuse or be unable to provide the necessary paperwork/documents.

Can anyone advise me if the solicitor is telling the absolute truth. I would be more than happy to change solicitors if I thought another one would fight for my daughter more.

Even if she were guilty it seems ridiculous that the matter can drag on so long but as she is completely innocent it is unfair that she has spent close to a year worrying about this and, really, with her life on hold. I want to take her on holiday to forget about this but I can't as we never know if the case will be called into the warned list