APCOA Luton Airport

maverick1970

hi just received parking charge notice .from apcoa on
my very first visit to luton airport.todrop off my son . I drove
around the one way system three times .I stopped near a small
roundabout to get my bearings my son got out. and then I spotted
a notice telling me iwill be charged my son then got back in. Ithen
found my way to the dropping area I. paid two pounds to drop him
off.my query is. should I have to pay a forty pound charge for stopping for twenty seconds .as Ipaid their 2 pounds charge .
my wife and I are both oap.s and are both disabled with the blue
badge regards.:j

bod1467

Short answer - No.

Longer answer - wait until Coupon Mad sees this; she'll love the fact you're disabled (being registered as such is even better). It sounds like the Equality Act 2010 may come into play.

I guess the only consideration is whether any byelaws come into play.

Guys_Dad

There are couple of other Airport threads around at the moment too. Have a look down a couple of pages and read the advice on them. A lot will apply to you too.

Various discussion on is it parking or not. This won't be repeated on your thread so I do urge you to read these other threads.

Coupon-mad

maverick1970 wrote: »

hi just received parking charge notice .from apcoa on
my very first visit to luton airport.todrop off my son . I drove
around the one way system three times .I stopped near a small
roundabout to get my bearings my son got out. and then I spotted
a notice telling me iwill be charged my son then got back in. Ithen
found my way to the dropping area I. paid two pounds to drop him
off.my query is. should I have to pay a forty pound charge for stopping for twenty seconds .as Ipaid their 2 pounds charge .
my wife and I are both oap.s and are both disabled with the blue
badge regards.:j

I would send this, unless it wasn't sent within 14 days of the incident in which case you can add another paragraph!



Dear APCOA,

Re fake PCN number xxxxxxxxxx

I am writing as I am the registered keeper of vehicle registration number xxxxxx and was sent a fake parking ticket from yourselves.

The short stay/drop off road layout at Luton Airport is confusing and badly-signposted which I am sure you will already know from previous complaints and appeals. And yet under the BPA Code of Practice you have a duty as an AOS member to clearly signpost an area you wish to enforce. Those signs must be visible an readable when a driver is still in the car, but at Luton Airport you have failed in this regard so seriously that one wonders if it is deliberate. The driver looked carefully but did not see any clear signage about where to drop a passenger until the car was stationary for a few seconds, purely in order for the driver and passenger to look at the nearest sign.

If you wish to enforce a no-stopping zone in one place and provide a drop-off area in another, then this must be crystal clear with multiple signs in order to avoid any possibility of confusion and forcing drivers to stop to read the signs. In fact the driver contends it was not clear at all and the car stopped for seconds just for the purpose of reading a sign. Your signage failure not only breaches your own industry code but is also unfair and a breach of the Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations 2008 and the Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999.

The driver entered into no contract with APCOA and as the registered keeper I am not liable either. Unfortunately for you, due to your own disregard of the BPA Code of Practice you have failed to establish 'keeper liability' as defined in the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 (POFA). In addition, Luton Airport land is covered by statutory byelaws and as such I believe it is not 'relevant land' as defined in Schedule 4 at all. Back to the drawing board with this site then, APCOA, because it appears to me that you can't rely on the POFA here. Would you like POPLA to confirm it?

Another point for you to note is that the driver, the registered keeper and one of the passengers that day are disabled. This is not mentioned as mitigation, far from it. This is a warning of potential further unlawful actions by yourselves on behalf of your clients at Luton Airport.

Now that you know the driver was disabled, you are exposed to a breach of the Equality Act 2010 (EA) and so are your clients, Luton Airport. No regard for the EA nor any 'reasonable adjustment' to signage is apparent whatsoever, to take account of the diverse needs of disabled drivers in that busy area. In addition, if you pursue the matter against me as registered keeper when you have no lawful excuse and cannot rely on 'keeper liability' at all in this instance, you will be guilty of harassment which is another specific breach of the EA and of the Protection from Harassment Act 1997.

For your further information, it is in the public domain that Luton Airport's parking enforcement is already the subject of an ongoing Police investigation in recent weeks, due to the allegedly illegal actions of their clamping/towing agent who have been forced to suspend activity. No doubt your Senior Management are aware of this and I am sure APCOA do not wish to follow suit nor to expose your clients to allegations of disability discrimination.

If APCOA refuse to cancel this 'ticket' then I invite you to reply to me at the above address stating your reasons and giving me a POPLA code. I will be more than happy to show POPLA the various breaches relating to this ticket and to call into question your lawful status and your attempt to blindly rely upon the POFA when Schedule 4 does not apply on Airport land. I will, of course, require a copy of your contract to be shown to POPLA - among other evidence - and the POPLA decision will be, as ever, at your expense.

I suggest it's cheaper and fairer for APCOA to address these issues and now spend some quality time cancelling this so-called 'parking' ticket, putting right your signage forthwith before a well-meaning person reports the glaring omissions to the BPA and DVLA, and thumbing through your copy of Schedule 4 of the POFA to gen up on what constitutes 'relevant land'.

yours,





Let us know how you get on and if you get sent a POPLA code do not write that stage of the appeal yourself. Did the postal fake 'ticket' arrive within 14 days of the incident?

Tallone_2

Coupon-mad wrote: »

I would send this, unless it wasn't sent within 14 days of the incident in which case you can add another paragraph!



Dear APCOA,

Re fake PCN number xxxxxxxxxx

I am writing as I am the registered keeper of vehicle registration number xxxxxx and was sent a fake parking ticket from yourselves.

The short stay/drop off road layout at Luton Airport is confusing and badly-signposted which I am sure you will already know from previous complaints and appeals. And yet under the BPA Code of Practice you have a duty as an AOS member to clearly signpost an area you wish to enforce. Those signs must be visible an readable when a driver is still in the car, but at Luton Airport you have failed in this regard so seriously that one wonders if it is deliberate. The driver looked carefully but did not see any clear signage about where to drop a passenger until the car was stationary for a few seconds, purely in order for the driver and passenger to look at the nearest sign.

If you wish to enforce a no-stopping zone in one place and provide a drop-off area in another, then this must be crystal clear with multiple signs in order to avoid any possibility of confusion and forcing drivers to stop to read the signs. In fact the driver contends it was not clear at all and the car stopped for seconds just for the purpose of reading a sign. Your signage failure not only breaches your own industry code but is also unfair and a breach of the Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations 2008 and the Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999.

The driver entered into no contract with APCOA and as the registered keeper I am not liable either. Unfortunately for you, due to your own disregard of the BPA Code of Practice you have failed to establish 'keeper liability' as defined in the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 (POFA). In addition, Luton Airport land is covered by statutory byelaws and as such I believe it is not 'relevant land' as defined in Schedule 4 at all. Back to the drawing board with this site then, APCOA, because it appears to me that you can't rely on the POFA here. Would you like POPLA to confirm it?

Another point for you to note is that the driver, the registered keeper and one of the passengers that day are disabled. This is not mentioned as mitigation, far from it. This is a warning of potential further unlawful actions by yourselves on behalf of your clients at Luton Airport.

Now that you know the driver was disabled, you are exposed to a breach of the Equality Act 2010 (EA) and so are your clients, Luton Airport. No regard for the EA nor any 'reasonable adjustment' to signage is apparent whatsoever, to take account of the diverse needs of disabled drivers in that busy area. In addition, if you pursue the matter against me as registered keeper when you have no lawful excuse and cannot rely on 'keeper liability' at all in this instance, you will be guilty of harassment which is another specific breach of the EA and of the Protection from Harassment Act 1997.

For your further information, it is in the public domain that Luton Airport's parking enforcement is already the subject of an ongoing Police investigation in recent weeks, due to the allegedly illegal actions of their clamping/towing agent who have been forced to suspend activity. No doubt your Senior Management are aware of this and I am sure APCOA do not wish to follow suit nor to expose your clients to allegations of disability discrimination.

If APCOA refuse to cancel this 'ticket' then I invite you to reply to me at the above address stating your reasons and giving me a POPLA code. I will be more than happy to show POPLA the various breaches relating to this ticket and to call into question your lawful status and your attempt to blindly rely upon the POFA when Schedule 4 does not apply on Airport land. I will, of course, require a copy of your contract to be shown to POPLA - among other evidence - and the POPLA decision will be, as ever, at your expense.

I suggest it's cheaper and fairer for APCOA to address these issues and now spend some quality time cancelling this so-called 'parking' ticket, putting right your signage forthwith before a well-meaning person reports the glaring omissions to the BPA and DVLA, and thumbing through your copy of Schedule 4 of the POFA to gen up on what constitutes 'relevant land'.

yours,





Let us know how you get on and if you get sent a POPLA code do not write that stage of the appeal yourself. Did the postal fake 'ticket' arrive within 14 days of the incident?

Hi, The post above by Coupon Mad suggests that the PCN should be sent within two weeks. I have a PCN from APCOA / Luton issued 27/8/13 with the notice given assumed 2 days after for an alleged contravention on 10/8/13. What extra paragraph should I insert.

thanks in advance

Coupon-mad

Broadsword's post here on pepipoo forum covers the late postal NTK issue:

http://forums.pepipoo.com/index.php?showtopic=80531

HTH and if you need more help when you get your rejection letter, or get nothing from APCOA and then a debt collector letter later on,
please click one click to the front page of the parking forum as shown in my signature below and start a new thread there.

Hoggmonkey

Sorry to hijak this thread just really need some help

My car is on mobility scheme and I just got a letter from July for being let out by a driver at airport. They don't know who the driver was but I'm worried mobility will take my car if I don't pay as I'm the registered owner ( not the driver though) what's best to do? I notice in the thread it says registered keeper is liable after october 1st.

pogofish

You don't hijack threads because it confuses people - You agreed not to do this in your signup!

Now just hang-on for your own thread to be answered and please stop taking these jokers seriously - you will not lose your car!

Tallone_2

After receiving a PCN from APCOA regarding a contravention at Luton airport I wrote back with the following after recieving help from Coupon - mad to whom I am now indebted

14th Sept 2013

Apcoa Parking
PO Box 1010
Middlesex
UB8 9NT

Dear Sir or Madam,

Ticket number: LM100
Vehicle registration number:

The unlawful issue of a ‘Notice to Keeper’ (BPA AOS Code of Practice B.22)

I am the registered keeper of a Land Rover motor vehicle registration number

I refer to recent PCN dated 27/8/2013.

I assume your “Parking Charge Notice” and the first line being “Notice is hereby served to the registered keeper” that this is a “Notice to Keeper” and along with other references drawn from the Protection of Freedoms Act (PoFA) it is clear that APCOA is dealing with its claim in accordance with the requirements of Schedule 4 of POFA.

The requirements of Schedule 4 PoFA are quite clear in that there must be strict compliance with all of its requirements in order to take advantage of the rights granted under that Act to pursue the registered keeper in respect of a driver’s alleged debt.

The BPA Ltd AOS Code of Practice (version 2) supports the need for strict compliance (para 21.5 refers).

APCOA has however failed to comply with the statutory requirements as follows;

Firstly, in regards to paragraph 9(2)(h) of Schedule 4, PoFA 2012. Whilst your ‘Notice to Keeper’ has indicated that you require a payment to be made to APCOA, there is no specific identification of the “Creditor”, who may, in law, be APCOA or London Luton Airport or, some other party.

PoFA requires a ‘Notice to Keeper’ to have words to the effect that “The Creditor is….”

The wording of Paragraph 9(2)(h) of Schedule 4 of PoFA does not indicate that the “creditor must be named, but “identified”. To “identify” a “Creditor” a parking company must do more than name that person. The driver is entitled to know the identity of the party with whom he has legally contracted.

This view is supported by the Secretary of State for Transport. He has reserved to himself powers to make regulations to specify not only what must be said in a ‘Notice to Keeper’ but also what evidence should be provided.

He says “The purpose of this power is to leave flexibility to mandate the specific evidence which must accompany a notice to keeper if it becomes clear that creditors are attempting to recover parking charges without providing keepers with sufficient evidence to know whether the claim is valid”

Secondly, in addition to APCOA’s failure to specifically identify the “Creditor”, it has failed to provide any evidence that it, or a third party, is entitled to enforce an alleged breach of contractual terms and conditions.

Thirdly, the most serious failure and that which has given me cause to submit a formal complaint to the DVLA.

You have failed to comply with paragraph 9.4 of Schedule 4 of the Act in that you failed to give the Notice to Keeper to me within the “relevant period”.

The alleged infringement occurred on the 10th August 2013 and no ‘Notice to Driver’ was issued at the time. The Notice to Keeper is dated 27th August 2013 which is 17 days after the event and too late to ensure delivery within the statutory 14 days prescribed by PoFA.

Paragraph 9(4) indicates that the Notice to Keeper must be given to the registered keeper not more than 14 days after the car allegedly infringed the car park terms and conditions. Paragraph 9(6) states that “A notice sent by post is to be presumed, unless the contrary is proved, to have been delivered (and so “given” for the purposes of sub-paragraph (4)) on the second working day after the day on which it is posted” which in this case would be the 29th August 2013.

Your company would have been well aware of these facts when it took the decision to send out the Notice to Keeper under PoFA. You have misrepresented the legal position in the full knowledge that there can be no keeper liability.

That is an aggravating feature which the DVLA must take into account in determining what sanction to issue to your company.

I therefore expect you to immediately cancel the ‘parking charge’ and inform me, in writing that you have done so.

If however, you reject this challenge, then, in accordance with the BPA Ltd AOS Code of Practice (version 2) 22.12, please ensure that you enclose all the required information (including the necessary ‘POPLA code’) so that I may immediately refer this matter (and any further issues that I may subsequently raise) for their adjudication on the matter.

I do not expect to receive a ‘generic’ template response and which fails to address the specific issues that I have raised with you. No further correspondence will be entered into.

Yours sincerely

[FONT=&quot]A[/FONT]

Apcoa have now written back with


Dear Fred Bloggs

Thankyou for your letter regarding the issue of the above Parking Charge Notice. We have considered fully your explanation of the circumstances and, on this occasion, cancelled the notice. Therefore no further action is required as the case is now considered closed.

Please be advised that there is 30minutes free parking in the mid term car park also, which is ideal for dropping off and picking up passengers. In future do bear in mind that you can make use of the free parking in the Mid Term Car Park also, and it is far more affordable.

So, all the people saying "Fight it" are correct. Thankyou everyone.

Umkomaas

Nice scything challenge. Well done on exposing the scamming nature and their blatant disregard of PoFA (that statement does presume they even understand it, but is open to question!).

But I wonder how many others have been similarly unlawfully pursued in exactly the same way - and have paid up. It's an absolute scandal.

Coupon-mad

Well done! I wonder if the actual thread-starter fared as well?!