DIY-Kitchens - any thoughts?

CKdesigner

DirectDebacle wrote: »

If they are that confident in their products then they should have no problem in naming the makes of kitchens they sell. For some reason they blatantly avoid giving any details of their products.

I have no problem in naming the German makes of kitchens we do but that could so easily be deemed as 'self promotion' and that isn't what I contribute to the forum for.

If you want to send me a PM requesting the information I will gladly oblige and send you links to our suppliers websites, our website and Facebook page where you will find just a small selection of pictures of kitchens I have designed and fitted.

CK

DirectDebacle

CKdesigner wrote: »

...If you want to send me a PM requesting the information I will gladly oblige...CK

CK,
PM sent.

sg0102

Sorry to interrupt the party guys, and thanks for keeping my post active at the top.....but back to DIY-kitchens....any thoughts???

ryder72

DirectDebacle - same offer open to you and others. If you need more information, PM me.

DirectDebacle

sg0102 wrote: »

Sorry to interrupt the party guys, and thanks for keeping my post active at the top.....but back to DIY-kitchens....any thoughts???

Apologies for hijacking your thread. I have no experience of DIY-kitchens so cannot give ant specific advice.Though I do have some general comments that will apply to most kitchens.

The foundation of any kitchen are the carcasses. My views apply to all makes of kitchens that use MFC to make their carcasses.

MFC is produced from particle board. This is an industry description:

Particle Board
Particle board is an engineered wood product manufactured from wood particles and a synthetic resin or other suitable binder. It is then pressed and bound to form sheets.

Particle board is a type of fiberboard, similar to MDF and hardboard, but made of larger pieces of wood.
Although it is denser than conventional wood, it is the lightest and weakest type of fiberboard, except for insulation board. Chipboard is perhaps the best known form of particle board, but other examples include flakeboard (used to board up damaged windows and doorways) and waferboard.
Particle board may be covered in a plastic veneer and used for specialist surfaces.

Furniture grade chipboard is made in two grades, P1 and P2 and three densities, high, medium and low. The longest guarantee available from most producers for this material is 25 years for P2. P1 is around 15 years. It is manufactured throughout Europe and has to meet EU standards. There will be virtually no difference in quality of this product between manufacturers. More variation will be found in the laminates applied to it.

When salesmen are giving you their opinion on quality of carcasses you know they are talking about the quality of the lowest grade of furniture construction material available. Joinery options are very limited and in the main will be cam and dowel, dowel and glue and perhaps some screws. Dowel and glue is touted as superior to cam and dowel. It may be, but not significantly so.

In terms of British v German or any other country manufacturing chipboard carcasses there is going to be no significant difference in quality of materials or construction methods. All will fail and need replacing. As a fixture and fitting in a house the chipboard kitchen is going to be one of the first things to fail. The more moving parts attached to a MFC carcass the quicker it will happen.

In another thread discussing whether or not to refurbish a kitchen with new doors/drawer fronts an independant kithen specialist held this view. If the units were more than 2 years old it wasn't worth it as the wear on the carcasses would be too great to make it worthwhile.

I wonder how many people are using 25 year old chipboard kitchens and how they have stood up to that length of usage. Be interesting to know.

My 16yr old B&Q chipboard kitchen is still serviceable but showing signs of failiure. The doors and drawer fronts are wood and are ok but the carcass is failing to grip the screws on a couple of runners. One side of a drawer front comes away from the MFC drawer box as a cam fitting has failed. Door hinges are so far ok.

ryder72

Good post Direct Debacle.

On the point of screws coming loose inside chipboard. All decent German kitchens I have looked at have plastic plugs press-fitted into pilot holes. Screws are then fitted into these plastic plugs ensuring that no deformation happens within the chipboard eliminating the problem of hinge plates coming loose. The same principle is applied to the hinge fixing within the door.

The other point briefly mentioned in an earlier post was the application of ABS edges. The kitchen manufacturer we deal with use 1.5mm profiled ABS edges but I am sure most decent German kitchens use a similar thickness ABS edge. The norm for British kitchens is 1-1.5mm PVC edges. This is another area where carcases fail - from water ingress. High quality impact resistant edging ensures that regular impacts from daily use do not cause the edging to detach allowing an ingress point for moisture/water.

OP - I dont know specifics of DIY-kitchens, but these above two points are worth checking out.

CKdesigner

Talking about the edging - a very small point but probably still worth a mention. We once had an English manufactured kitchen (from one of the better mid range manufacturers) in a previous house and that had thin PVC edging to the shelves, this leaves quite a sharp edge and on a few occasions I would cut a knuckle on this sharp edge while reaching into the cupboard. This wouldn't happen with a proper thick ABS edge that is nicely rounded off.

Steve_the_fitter

Diy kitchens use high density egger chipboard with a 2mm bevel abs front edge. All screws for hinges doors etc use a plastic plug so there are no screws direct into chipboard. Very study legs and cabinets are glued and dowel under pressure to give a true square cabinet. In all honesty you will be hard pushed to find a better cabinet. Just make sure you order the correct items as you will pay for any mistakes.

rayzie

forget Laminate, granite I would say is the best stone. quartz is good but I don't like the man made look.