Section 21 Notice... but difficult to move out

Cody

Dear Forum;

I have been living with my partner and my 2 children (now 2 and 5) in our current property for 5 years, to a private landlord. We have never been late with rent or been a nusiance in any way.

Last week we were provided with a Section 21 (4) to vacate property in two months time, which was a little out of the blue.

In the background we have been looking at moving to Ireland to buy a property, we currently live in London. The process is taking longer than we had hoped, and will not be completed by end of August,

I have asked the letting agent to speak with the landlady about delaying our move out date by a couple of months, but she is not budging apparently, this is not surprising as she is not very pleasent in general.

So, what to do. We do not want to sign even a 6 month tenancy in London since we hope to be moving within a few months. The same goes for renting short term in Ireland. We also want to avoid upheaval to the boys in their schooling and multiple moves, our current home is the only home they have ever known and any move is going to be a big change, let alone two possible moves in a short space of time.

Has anybody any suggestions, I believe my options are either try to negotiate again with the landlady providing more details of predicament and hope she shows some flexibility,...or I can be difficult and not move out our against her wishes and have the extra 6-8 weeks? until she can obtain a possession order. which might be enough time...not something I am keen to do tbh.


So, in a dilema.



Many thanks in advance



Cody

G_M

You've pretty well summed it up I'm afraid.

I assume you do not have a fixed term tenancy? It is Periodic ('rolling' 'monthly')?

You can always try negotiating, ideally with the landlord direct, but she does not have to agree to anything.

If you do not know her address, you can write requesting it and the agent HAS to give it to you within 21 days of a written request.

Landlord & Tenant Act 1985 section 1.

You could check the S21 is valid. Have they got the dates right? Did you pay a deposit and was it registered within 30 days? Read:

Ending/Renewing an AST (what happens when the Fixed Term ends?)(What is a Periodic Tenancy?)(How can a LL remove a tenant?)(How can a tenant end a tenancy?)

You could wait till the LL gets a court order, which gains you time.

Beyond that, I'm afraid....

I_have_spoken

Yep, S21 is a notice to quit. You could spin out occupancy until LL gets the Court Order then go to the Council as homeless if you still haven't bought in Ireland.

Werdnal

I_have_spoken wrote: »

Yep, S21 is a notice to quit.

No it isn't. LL cannot issue NTQ. It is Notice Seeking Possession, and the notice alone does not end the tenancy or mean the tenant has to leave.

Only a court can end the tenancy with the PO, and if there is any chance the notice is incorrectly served or invalid, the notice may not result in gaining the PO. However, there is nothing in OP's post to suggest that the notice is invalid.

OP, the landlord here would be very foolish indeed to offer you confirmation that you can stay an extra X weeks, as this would be construed by the courts as "extending" your tenancy and would invalidate her notice, meaning she would have to start all over again with another S21/2 month's notice. The only way she could allow you to stay longer would be to hold off applying to court when the S21 expires. She may do this, she may not be on the ball and apply straight away anyway, but don't expect any verbal or written confirmation of this as she will not want to jeaopardise the notice and have to start again!

I think you already know the answer to this - you either stick it out to the bitter end and hope the LL is late applying to court to win you a few extra weeks, or try to find some alternative accommodation and leave willingly. Don't forget you need to give your own 1 month's notice if you plan to leave.

G_M

I_have_spoken wrote: »

Yep, S21 is a notice to quit. ....

As Werdnal says, this is rubbish.

You do NOT have to leave on the date provided on the S21.

Mr_Moo_2

We came close to this situation, and we're more flexible with no kids to worry about so I can share the stress. How confident are you that you can secure another place in the timeframe that holding out for formal repossession would give you? If you stay on, you'll get a duff reference from your LL but if you're not planning on another rental then that isn't an issue. So while it might bring its own stress, that would avoid a double move.

There are lots of slips and twists for a LL to serve a correct S21, mightr be worth getting someone to double check the validity. If invalid this would buy you more time as it would have to be done again. The links provided give a very good overview of obligations on all parties.

Cody

Thanks Everyone.

The house purchase is likely to happen within a few months....although i am learning now these things do drag on. I would be hopeful however that we will have somewhere to move in by end of September.

I'm going to try and renegotiate the leaving date, I fear hanging on longer than allowed might cost us with court fees? I believe the S21 is correct, it seesm to tick all the boxes, i.e. states Section 21 (4), was delivered before the rent due date, states move out date day before rent date in two months and our deposit is in a scheme.

thanks again

Cody

Cody

A follow up question.

I am going to try and negotiate with the LL, but think it wise to know possible costs of delaying the move against LL's as well. Are tenants responsible for costs incurred by LL for obtaining a possession order for example?

I'm just going to be honest and explain that it is going to be very difficult to move out within the time frame, and possibly we will not be able to despite our best efforts, and see what she says.

thanks

Cody

G_M

Sorry. I can't answer the costs question. I've been fortunate in never having to enforce a S21 via the courts!

But in negotiating, if you can offer an alternative,later, date, the LL is far more likely to be agreeable than if you leave it vague and open-ended.

Though I appreciate in house-buying,it is hard to have an exact date....

thesaint

If the landlord asks for costs, then they will be awarded.
Intial court costs are £175, then £110 for bailiffs.

Cody

Thanks, very precise costs!

A new question, the S21 letter uses the letting agents address, does not reference the actual landlords address. I fully expect this is ok, but asking incase it is not, and a possible bargaining point.

Cody