NHS pay band & associated authority question

FBaby

Over a band 8? Now you are saying you are a band 9???? I'm sorry but I don't believe for a second that anyone who has worked for the NHS for 2 months only could possibly have the skills to assess their band. It takes months of training and experience to be able to gain the skills to do so. Are you saying that you understand the distinction between sensitive information and highly sensitive information? Yet that can be a contributory factor in deciding if you are a band 7 or a band 8a.

Band 8as manage budgets in millions, not £100K, let alone £30K. Oh and I don't know one job within NHS England at band 8a level or above that wouldn't require prior NHS experience or at least a thorough understanding of its practices.

If you want to believe that you are doing the job of an 8a that's your choice, but you might want to do more research than your own quick assessment if you intend to raise this with your boss. By the way, what band are they?

Coraline

FBaby wrote: »

Over a band 8? Now you are saying you are a band 9???? I'm sorry but I don't believe for a second that anyone who has worked for the NHS for 2 months only could possibly have the skills to assess their band. It takes months of training and experience to be able to gain the skills to do so. Are you saying that you understand the distinction between sensitive information and highly sensitive information? Yet that can be a contributory factor in deciding if you are a band 7 or a band 8a.

Band 8as manage budgets in millions, not £100K, let alone £30K. Oh and I don't know one job within NHS England at band 8a level or above that wouldn't require prior NHS experience or at least a thorough understanding of its practices.

If you want to believe that you are doing the job of an 8a that's your choice, but you might want to do more research than your own quick assessment if you intend to raise this with your boss. By the way, what band are they?

when did I say I was even close to band 9? When have I ever been as hostile as you? I started
this thread to deal with legal issues and authorisation. I came to to forum about NHS banding and legal impercussions.

FBaby, your mistake is that you assume just because someone wasn't NHS means they aren't qualified....



I really hate this, I find some Internet folks in the UK that can help and within 24 hours stuff like this pours in.

Coraline

"Fbaby"is on ignore permanently, I don't have patience with people with agendas. What is it with these internet forums?

Person_one

Coraline wrote: »

"Fbaby"is on ignore permanently, I don't have patience with people with agendas. What is it with these internet forums?

Fbaby might not be telling you what you want to hear, but it sounds to me like they're making very valid points that would be helpful if you could calmly take them on board.

polgara

Afc job evaluation is based on your job description so the first question is does it encompass everything that you are doing? If not, you need to discuss with your manager about making amendments. Only then will you stand a chance if having a banding review. As said previously reading the job evaluation handbook and totting up your points won't necessarily mean you are right. Afc panel members are trained to undertake job evaluation. Are you leading services, responsible for strategy/programmes of work, a people manager? Does your jd say lead or co-ordinate/support? I have been writing job descriptions under AfC now since it came in and there is a big difference between a band 7 and an 8a onwards and I have had a few that don't always hit a band 8a. No offence but if I don't always get it right then I doubt you've correctly matched ALL the factors correctly.

Get advice - union and/or HR

Coraline

Person_one wrote: »

Fbaby might not be telling you what you want to hear, but it sounds to me like they're making very valid points that would be helpful if you could calmly take them on board.

I can determine quite quickly who knows what they're talking about and who's full of it. Hence my decision to filter out drivel. I appreciate calm responses with advice, not rants directed towards me based on assumptions about...what exactly?

Coraline

polgara wrote: »

Afc job evaluation is based on your job description so the first question is does it encompass everything that you are doing? If not, you need to discuss with your manager about making amendments. Only then will you stand a chance if having a banding review. As said previously reading the job evaluation handbook and totting up your points won't necessarily mean you are right. Afc panel members are trained to undertake job evaluation. Are you leading services, responsible for strategy/programmes of work, a people manager? Does your jd say lead or co-ordinate/support? I have been writing job descriptions under AfC now since it came in and there is a big difference between a band 7 and an 8a onwards and I have had a few that don't always hit a band 8a. No offence but if I don't always get it right then I doubt you've correctly matched ALL the factors correctly.

Get advice - union and/or HR

The Job description said "Officer," but the Director insisted on calling me a lead. The duties I'm expected to carry out are at director level. We have over a dozen offices that together, serve all of England. Each of these offices have at minimum one band 8 PR director that oversees PR for about 150 employees. Most have 2 or 3 to split the work load, currently I'm the only one.

It's long term, strategic planning work involving dealing with many parties, the media, FOI, and now multiple budgets. Master's degree educated equivalent, many years experience required, blah blah blah....but it's a lot.

I am being deliberately vague to the exact details since this is the internet. But colleagues I've talked with (in person) who have been in the NHS for decades and know this stuff backwards and forwards say that I am a band 8a, no question.

FBaby

Coraline, I'm very sorry if you felt attacked by my posts. I can see how they came across as patronising. However, you seem totally unwilling to appreciate that some people might have a lot more experience of what you are talking about than yourself.

The NHS is an organisation with a culture of its own and it takes years to really understand its drivers. You thinking that only 2 months into it, you can know what is right or wrong does smack of arrogance.

Your posts have evolved quite a bit from what you first posted. If you re-read your original one, you will notice that you asked whether what you were describing was something a band 8a or over would routinely do. You've asked for advice from those with knowledge of pay band. I did, and on that basis, I could quite confidently respond that no, it didn't, but you took offense to it. You then went on saying that your job is indeed stategic with hight level responsibilities, but don't want to say too much about it. Maybe if you did, it would bring another perspective to it rather than what you stated in your initial post.

What you seem to be experiencing is very common to the primary care environment of the NHS. What I can advise you is to learn how others cope with it and take a similar approach rather than raising expectations about what you think it should be like. I can say that from experience, that the last thing a boss -who is probably feeling as, if not more, pressurised than you- will want is a staff who puts even more pressure on him, leading to them having to spend most of their time dealing with HR rather than getting on with deadlines. If you feel that the stress is starting to affect you, go and tell them and ask if you can be reassured that they are happy with how you are currently carrying your tasks and whether something will be done to help with the workload. If you are indeed performing above your level, then keep track of it, and if a band 8a job comes up, you will be able to apply for it and state how you have built experience to take on the role with your manager supporting you.

LannieDuck

I had another thought. If the (possibly) 8a work you're doing now is nominally someone else's job and you're being asked to take it on temporarily (this may not be the case; I'm a little unclear about the exact arrangements), then you might be entitled to 'acting up' payments because the work you're covering is a higher pay-grade.

Could you remind me if you have a job description, and how much of what you currently do is covered by it?

Coraline

LannieDuck wrote: »

I had another thought. If the (possibly) 8a work you're doing now is nominally someone else's job and you're being asked to take it on temporarily (this may not be the case; I'm a little unclear about the exact arrangements), then you might be entitled to 'acting up' payments because the work you're covering is a higher pay-grade.

Could you remind me if you have a job description, and how much of what you currently do is covered by it?

It's a full time 8a post that I've been assigned permanently and it's gone through business services authority. (ETA: It should be an 8a post after much research and dialogue with colleagues, but the job description lists it as a 6--basically it's the job description for an assistant that I need)

I have a job description that was given to me a month after the fact that was written about six months ago, with a different title and out-of-date specifics.

Currently I do everything listed on the job description, and a lot more.

If you follow this link, and go to "Communications Service Manager" that is the job description that actually describes what I'm responsible for and currently doing (on top of the band 4 PA Administrative job I'm doing as well).

The model across the board in my fellow offices is at mininum one person 8a fitting that job description, with an assistant at band 6. Currently I do not have an assistant which affects item #9.

http://www.nhsemployers.org/PayAndContracts/AgendaForChange/NationalJobProfiles/Documents/Public_Relations.pdf