How do Architects fees work?

ipri

Hi,
We have an Architect to do our extension...fees for administering build are "5% of the construction"...is that 5% of the total price of the project... including material / labour etc. ?

thanks

MX5huggy

Yes and 5% is fairly low for full contract administration from a RIBA member.

I expect it would not be 5% on the VAT charged but check.

Hintza

Assuming you have a good one they are well worth the money when the builder tries to take short cuts etc.

mymedi

Assuming that 5% is only for the build stage, that's quite reasonable.
What I've always found unreasonable is that the total construction budget includes materials. I can choose cheap laminate or choose to deck out the place in marble - the architect has absolutely no influence or effect on either, so why do they get a cut of the materials...?

Hintza

mymedi wrote: »

so why do they get a cut of the materials...?

Well you don't have to use them and could therefore save the 5%.

mymedi

Hintza wrote: »

Assuming you have a good one they are well worth the money

I agree with this. It's just that I think everyone should be paid for the actual work they do as opposed to increasing my expense for no good reason. :A

tired_dad

If they are project managing the installation of the interior fittings, then it's not unreasonable to charge. Installation of a 100k kitchen is more work than a 8k one.

mymedi

tired_dad wrote: »

Installation of a 100k kitchen is more work than a 8k one.

Yes, of course. Slightly - it's all basically the same: cabinets, appliances, work surfaces, lighting.
So, more work, but not to the tune of 5% of kitchen cost - 100K * 5% = 5K... That's 7-8 full working days full time work at 75 pounds per hour!

Besides, architects usually do the whole project from plans to completion (not just project managing the build - that's where a Clerk of Works is often quite sufficient). And the fees for the whole project are based the same - on total cost. And they usually run between 12-17%.
So, in many cases we're talking a difference between 8K*15%=1200 and 100K*15%=15K - 13.8K in fees just because of expensive kitchen... That's unreasonable in my book.

System

normally the percentage fee is based on the build costs of the shell and a basic level of fniish - rather than to a finish with client specified items (like kitchens/taps etc)
If you are spending 100k on a kitchen it's more than likely there will be a specialist consultant/contractor doing the drawings/fit out anyway so not within the scope of the architects works
Unless there are specifics involved with finishes etc (for example tile layouts etc) it shouldn't have implications on the fee

mymedi

the_r_sole wrote: »

Unless there are specifics involved with finishes etc (for example tile layouts etc) it shouldn't have implications on the fee

I wish that was the case - I interviewed several architects for our latest project (which doesn't even involve actual building - just renovations) and all of them included everything into the build cost, and those I asked about it refused to exclude the high-priced items/fixtures/materials...
Needless to say they did not get the job.

System

renovation and fit out is precisely about the finishes and that's what dictates the complexity and value of the job - the op is asking about a building which is a different beast altogether