Smart parking charge notice

snazzybiz

This is my first post so sorry if i am doing it wrong.

On Tuesday i parked in what i thought was an Aldi car park in Swanley as i was parked opposite the store but it turned out that it was actually a permit holders car park and i was issued with a Smart parking charge notice reason no valid permit.

i was visiting an event my husband was running and planned to go into Aldi on my return, but when i popped back to the car and saw the ticket i moved the car elsewhere, so never actually got to Aldi.

i am currently using a courtesy car as my car is being repaired and due to come back tomorrow.

The ticket was placed on the windscreen on the courtesy car.

when i parked neither me or my passenger saw any signs to say no parking etc. i also had a blue badge on display just in case thats of any importance.

i know that i should not pay this as they are scammers but i am worried as the ticket is not against my car its against the courtesy car. i have read that if i appeal it will transfer over to my details and they will chase me but im not sure how to do it.

should i use the appeal section on their website?
do you get a confirmation email ?

any help would be appreciated as i am panicking about the car going back tomorrow and the ticket being registered against it still.

Thanks Hayley xx

Computersaysno

snazzybiz wrote: »

[STRIKE]

This is my first post so sorry if i am doing it wrong.

On Tuesday i parked in what i thought was an Aldi car park in Swanley as i
was parked opposite the store but it turned out that it was actually a permit
holders car park and i was issued with a Smart

[/STRIKE]parking charge notice [STRIKE]

reason no valid permit.

i was visiting an event my husband was running and planned to go into Aldi on
my return, but when i popped back to the car and saw the ticket i moved the car
elsewhere, so never actually got to Aldi.
i am currently using a courtesy car as my car is being repaired and due to
come back tomorrow.

The ticket was placed on the windscreen on the courtesy car.
when i parked neither me or my passenger saw any signs to say no parking etc.
i also had a blue badge on display just in case thats of any importance.

i know that i should not pay this as they are scammers but i am worried as
the ticket is not against my car its against the courtesy car. i have read that
if i appeal it will transfer over to my details and they will chase me but im
not sure how to do it.

should i use the appeal section on their website?
do you get a confirmation email ?

any help would be appreciated as i am panicking about the car going back
tomorrow and the ticket being registered against it still.

Thanks Hayley xx
[/STRIKE]

I scored out the unneeded bits of your post...when you look at what's left the answer is IMO obvious..... ignore all letters unless genuine court papers turn up [virtually no chance of that, and even then you will win].

Other will be along shortly to say 'Appeal and then POPLA'....this takes more effort and ends the same way...ie you don't pay.

Take your choice.

snazzybiz

ignore it even though its not my car ????
will the letters not go through to the courtesy car company and they will bill me for it???

Sorry as i said im not going to pay it but how do i get them to chase me and not the courtesy car company?
Thanks Hayley

nigelbb

snazzybiz wrote: »

ignore it even though its not my car ????
will the letters not go through to the courtesy car company and they will bill me for it???

Sorry as i said im not going to pay it but how do i get them to chase me and not the courtesy car company?
Thanks Hayley

In your case telling you to ignore this PCN is terrible advice. You will need to deflect Smart Parking from the registered keeper by responding to the notice confirming that you were the driver & challenging the charge. The challenge will inevitably be rejected but with advice from here & https://www.pepipoo.com an appeal to the 'independent' body POLA will succeed but not using any of the arguments that you might imagine. They need to be put on the spot to justify their entitlement to levy a charge in the first place.

Guys_Dad

nigelbb wrote: »

In your case telling you to ignore this PCN is terrible advice. You will need to deflect Smart Parking from the registered keeper by responding to the notice confirming that you were the driver & challenging the charge. The challenge will inevitably be rejected but with advice from here & https://www.pepipoo.com an appeal to the 'independent' body POLA will succeed but not using any of the arguments that you might imagine. They need to be put on the spot to justify their entitlement to levy a charge in the first place.

I agree. computersayno is a one-solution-fits-all approach and has clearly not taken on board that it was a courtesy car and it is imperative that you contact them - and the PPC - to stop the garage paying and then charging your debit/credit card. Instruct the garage that under no account should they pay if they get any correspondence from the PPC. Do that in writing as well.

Some people say that ignoring is the best policy for tickets from PPCs. Sometimes it is, but increasingly evidence is showing that appeals to POPLA, if properly constructed, are a good route forward with a good success rate. And, of course, you still have the court if the PPC pursues it.

But please come back before submitting your appeal to the PPC and, in particular, POPLA. Certainly NO ADMISSION OF ANY "GUILT" SHOULD BE IN ANY APPEAL. Guaranteed a loser if you do and your post is an admission of "guilt".

Computersaysno

Apologies, I was in a rush this morning.

Yes contact the RK and explain they ere not to pay on your acct etc.

Again, apologies.

snazzybiz

Thank you for your replies, do i need to pay for a popla appeal? if so how much is it ?
i read somewhere that its £27 to appeal.

Thanks Hayley

Umkomaas

snazzybiz wrote: »

Thank you for your replies, do i need to pay for a popla appeal? if so how much is it ?
i read somewhere that its £27 to appeal.

Thanks Hayley

It is £27 + VAT to appeal to POPLA. BUT, the good news for you is that the fee is payable by the PPC, and, even in the (unlikely, with good advice from here) event of a rejection of your appeal by POPLA, the charge cannot be passed to you by the PPC. Even if you 'lose' at POPLA, their decision is only binding on the PPC, not the motorist.

As a footnote, the overall average cost of a POPLA appeal to the PPC is, quite possibly, £137.30 - see The Parking Prankster's blog - well worth a read:

http://parking-prankster.blogspot.co.uk/2013/05/how-much-does-popla-cost.html

hoohoo

nigelbb wrote: »

In your case telling you to ignore this PCN is terrible advice. You will need to deflect Smart Parking from the registered keeper by responding to the notice confirming that you were the driver & challenging the charge. The challenge will inevitably be rejected but with advice from here & https://www.pepipoo.com an appeal to the 'independent' body POLA will succeed but not using any of the arguments that you might imagine. They need to be put on the spot to justify their entitlement to levy a charge in the first place.

I would like to agree with Nigel except on one point.

I would also appreciate regular posters on here considering this carefully to see if I have made any mistakes.

This is new advice following this thread on pepipoo, where it is now clear that the 'keeper' is not the same as Registered Keeper under the meaning of the POFA 2012 act.

http://forums.pepipoo.com/index.php?showtopic=79530


When you write to the parking operator, therefore, do not say who the driver was. Just say you are the keeper. This keeps the identity of the driver undisclosed, as is your right.

POFA 2012 defines the 'keeper' as:

“keeper” means the person by whom the vehicle is kept
at the time the vehicle was parked, which in the case of a
registered vehicle is to be presumed, unless the contrary
is proved, to be the registered keeper;

As you currently have a courtesy car, even though it is also a hire car, I think it reasonable under the definition of the act to consider yourself as the keeper until you return it to them.

One other point. Smart Parking are undergoing an identity crisis. If you can get back to the car park easily and the signs still say 'town and city ltd' get photos before they change the signs. Especially photograph any signs where the 'Ltd' is either easily visible or has been badly coloured in with black felt pen.

nigelbb

A very good point hoohoo. Even in those cases where the actual driver wants to deflect the PPC from a hire or lease company or wants to prevent them harassing a relative who is the registered keeper then there is no need to admit to being the driver even when responding to a Notice To Driver left on the car. It is enough to declare "I am the keeper as defined by Schedule 4 of POFA 2012"

Half_way

To the OP: this is what may/could happen if you ignore a ticket/charge placed on a rental/hire/lease car

Parking company obtains the vehicle information ( registered keeper etc) from the DVLA
In the case of hire/lease/rental this will go to the hire/lease/rental company.
Depsite what their own terms and conditions say, quite a few hire/lease/rental companys will pay the private parking company, and then charge you the sum plus an admin fee, even though private tickets are not ( technicaly) fines/penaltys or issued by a statory authority.

Once the above has occured you have got a fight on your hands to get your money back, sometimes it can be done with a letter/face to face talk, sometimes it needs the threat of legal action, and in some cases it needs you to issue a claim form ( ie court action) against the hire/lease/rental company.
And that is something that you could do without.

Whilst POPLA is there it may as well be made use of, it costs the PPC ( private parking company) £27+Vat ( although the parking prankster blog puts this figure much higher ) and it only costs you some time.
Regardless of what popla say, the decision at the end of it all is only binding upon the parking company, and not on the driver/registred keeper.
Should Shona and co get thier knickers in a twist and turn down your challenge, you can then set out on the ignore path, as these tickets are still as unenforcable as ever, just keep this place informed of what pops through your letter box.
You may have seen one parking company in particular start issuing court/claim forms, as yet non of these have been through the court system, but their are plenty of people keeping an eye on this PPC, however it should be remebered that the status of parking charges with respect to contract law etc is still the same as it always was before.