Train Fine Appeal Rejected.

Heaneyboxing

Hi,

Can't find another place to put this thread so hopefully this ok.

Basically on the 4th of may I travelled on a train from stoke to London Euston. I had already pre paid for the ticket online. Due to arriving late I did not have time to put my confirmation code in the machine and get the ticket from it.

I boarded the train knowing that I had paid for the ticket and that I had my confirmation email on my phone to show the train manager.

Well the manager would not listen to a word I said, he wouldn't look at my confirmation email and told me I needed to pay for another ticket (which was double the price at £40) or a fine.

He said I should have read the terms and conditions about boarding without a valid ticket and I replied that I did not (who does?).

I refused to pay for another ticket and was issued a penalty notice which i was told by the main train manager that if I sent the valid ticket off within 10 days of the notice I would not have to pay £128.

Now, I sent the ticket off with the penalty notice and they received it on the 9th (5 days later) and they have sent me a letter back saying they have rejected my appeal!!!

How can is be? It was the valid ticket for the penalty I had been issued.

I really don't know what to do? I have only just seen the letter today as the letter didn't have my full name and had my dads name (we both have the same first name) so I didn't open it thinking it was his and he was in Spain the last 10 days.

I do not want to pay the fine as I have already paid for the ticket and can prove so through the bank etc.

Thank you for any help,

Nathan.

p00hsticks

i'm not an expert but I can't see that you have a leg to stand on, I'm afraid. It's not enough to have paid for a ticket, you have to have it with you when you travel.

the.weekender

Nathan
railforums.co.uk have a section on their forum to help and give advice on these sort of matters.

Jeff_Bridges_hair

Who did you travel with, Virgin trains or London Midland?

It is not a fine, only a court can impose a fine on you.

The onus is on you to have a valid ticket when travelling on the railway. In this case, you did not. Irrespective of whether you can prove you purchased one that is not the same as having the ticket with you when asked to present it whilst on board the train.

Do as the.weekender says and visit that website, I doubt very much there is anything they can help you with in your appeal as you have clearly been caught red handed but it cant hurt can it.

securityguy

Why didn't you just either have the ticket as a print-at-home, or collect it prior to travelling (days in advance, if you booked it days in advance). "I didn't have time to collect the ticket" is the flimsiest of excuses.

flicks

Think you're going to have to take this one on the chin OP. Where I totally agree that very few people read the terms and conditions they are still there and need to be adhered to

. Not doubting your honesty for one moment but as far as the train operator is concerned, you have the email to say you'd bought the ticket but is somebody else travelling with the actual ticket as well?

Stigy

I think you were probably issued an Unpaid Fare Notice if it was a Train Manager that issued it. This isn't a fine, but neither is a Penalty Fare Notice. There's no specific appeals procedure for an Unpaid Fares Notice anyway, as it's not there as a Penalty, just a ticket basically. Obviously you can always attempt to appeal anyway, but chances are it'll fall on deaf ears.

The onus is on the passenger to be able to produce a ticket for their journey, and you couldn't do so. It seems quite clear cut unfortunately.

cookie365

The emails you get with the code reference make it really really clear that you need to get the ticket before boarding, and the emails aren't valid for travel.

Otherwise people would just carry fake email printouts that the ticket inspectors would have no way of checking.

LexyBoy

Consider yourself lucky that you were given (by the sounds of it) an unpaid fares notice, which is basically an invoice for the amount owed. Some operators would have reported you for prosecution at the point where you refused to pay (and they would be successful if persued).

Yes it may be unfair but there are good reasons.

katejo

I agree with what others say . It is your responsibility to allow enough time to get your ticket . Did you see the recent example of someone who was unable to collect their ticket because the machine was faulty. They still got fined . In my opinion they had a valid case but you don't

yangptangkipperbang

cookie365 wrote: »

Otherwise people would just carry fake email printouts that the ticket inspectors would have no way of checking.

.........and even if the email was genuine that doesn't stop someone else actually travelling on the actual ticket at the same time...........