Landlord bill problem

Billy84_2

Hi.. So, i have a problem and I wondered if anyone could help.

We've lived in our current home for about 3 years now, give or take. When we first moved in, our landlord gave us the impression that we would have our electricity bill in with our rent. He said that occasionally, if the bill was high, we may need to "Chip in"... We obviously jumped at this chance. Rightly or wrongly we didn't question this, we just said yes. Recently he has not only said that we now have to start paying (which is fine, and we're happy to pay). But, he's also retrospectively added £30 back electricity for every month that we've lived here (which amounts to about £960) and he's insisting that we pay him an extra £60 a month 30 pounds for electricity and £30 to cover "arrears". He has also taken the highly unethical (and possibly illegal?) step of sending me a text saying "could you please try to arrange a loan to pay off these arrears?"
The electricity bill is in the landlords name... There are 3 flats in our building (an old converted victorian house) And although i've asked him if it's possible for us to have our own bill he has said it isn't... He's also never showed us a bill at any time. It seems like he's just plucked this arbitrary amount of £30 out of thin air.... It all feels very unfair to us. Our tenancy agreement doesn't have any mention of any of this. In fact, it says that we are reponsible for all bills. It doesn't mention that electricity is in with the rent at all. In the almost 3 years since we moved in he only started mentioning these "arrears" in the last few months or so... My partner and I have been payin him the extra £60 a month to keep him onside and to try not to rock the boat.. But, I'll be honest, the demands from him to get a loan has really put me on edge, and made me quite angry.

My real question is this.. Does the landlord actually have a leg to stand on? Am i responsible for a bill that isn't in my name, isn't specifically for our flat, and wasn't set out in our tenancy?

As I've said, i would be happy to pay for electricity if it was all above board and fair. But, to be perfectly honest, I feel as if our landlord is attempting to extort my family.

(also.. is him saying that we should get a loan to pay back a debt that is totally in his name illegal... It feels illegal)

DRP

Billy84 wrote: »

Hi.. So, i have a problem and I wondered if anyone could help.

We've lived in our current home for about 3 years now, give or take. When we first moved in, our landlord gave us the impression that we would have our electricity bill in with our rent. He said that occasionally, if the bill was high, we may need to "Chip in"... We obviously jumped at this chance. Rightly or wrongly we didn't question this, we just said yes. Recently he has not only said that we now have to start paying (which is fine, and we're happy to pay). But, he's also retrospectively added £30 back electricity for every month that we've lived here (which amounts to about £960) and he's insisting that we pay him an extra £60 a month 30 pounds for electricity and £30 to cover "arrears". He has also taken the highly unethical (and possibly illegal?) step of sending me a text saying "could you please try to arrange a loan to pay off these arrears?"
The electricity bill is in the landlords name... There are 3 flats in our building (an old converted victorian house) And although i've asked him if it's possible for us to have our own bill he has said it isn't... He's also never showed us a bill at any time. It seems like he's just plucked this arbitrary amount of £30 out of thin air.... It all feels very unfair to us. Our tenancy agreement doesn't have any mention of any of this. In fact, it says that we are reponsible for all bills. It doesn't mention that electricity is in with the rent at all. In the almost 3 years since we moved in he only started mentioning these "arrears" in the last few months or so... My partner and I have been payin him the extra £60 a month to keep him onside and to try not to rock the boat.. But, I'll be honest, the demands from him to get a loan has really put me on edge, and made me quite angry.

My real question is this.. Does the landlord actually have a leg to stand on? Am i responsible for a bill that isn't in my name, isn't specifically for our flat, and wasn't set out in our tenancy?

As I've said, i would be happy to pay for electricity if it was all above board and fair. But, to be perfectly honest, I feel as if our landlord is attempting to extort my family.

(also.. is him saying that we should get a loan to pay back a debt that is totally in his name illegal... It feels illegal)

:rotfl:

tell him to jog on...

Seriously i don't know why you are even paying him the extra £30, his name is on the bill so he has to pay it...

He sounds well dodgy - has he protected your deposit, does he get you an annual gas safety check etc?

Billy84_2

We've recently been realising more and more that he is a bit of a scam artist. And no we have never got a gas safety certificate.

To be honest, i'm not sure the best way to say no.. We have a young baby, and i don't really relish the possibility of being evicted.. I know he's in the wrong really, it's just good to gt some confirmation.

princeofpounds

If the bill has been in his name for three years and he has happily paid then it shows very strong intention on his part to have a contractual relationship with you where he pays the electricity. In the absence of writing (even better if you have some direct or indirect reference to this arrangement in writing/email\text) this is what a small claims court would look at.

Furthermore, you are right, if he set up the account in his name then it it not your liability.

He cannot ask for back payments (well, he can but he is not entitled) and overcharging you for electricity going forwards is not allowed legally; google ofgem's maximum resale price rules. He must also account for how he is billing you.

Personally, this goes beyond 'keep the peace' behaviour. Of course he might terminate your tenancy at the next available opportunity but better to leave him a void and escape a bully.

I would elevate this to writing, make clear the basis on which you were renting the property, tell him that you will pay the electricity only on transparent terms and market price. A bit of assertiveness might put him back in his box, though it's probably gone a bit far for that.

Bet he has subdivided the house without planning permission and there is only a single meter for all three houses.

DRP

Billy84 wrote: »

We've recently been realising more and more that he is a bit of a scam artist. And no we have never got a gas safety certificate.

To be honest, i'm not sure the best way to say no.. We have a young baby, and i don't really relish the possibility of being evicted.. I know he's in the wrong really, it's just good to gt some confirmation.

..and the deposit?

personally, whatever comes out of this, I would be seriously looking at places to move to at the moment... No gas safety (and who knows what else is 'dodgy') with a baby in the house. He doesn't seem to care about your well-being, so I would return this in kind by looking after yourselves and not paying him a penny that you are not legally obliged to.

princeofpounds

The best way to say no is firmly and in writing!

And ask for a gas safety certificate at the same time. That"s one thing he can be fined for already, so you have more power than you think.

Is your deposit protected? Have you checked with the scheme and received the proscribed information?

Stand up for yourself!

Billy84_2

We only paid a small, nominal deposit when we moved in.. £100.. And i've never heard that it has been put into any sort of scheme..

Thnk you all for your advice. I'm definitely going to be more assertive in my dealings with him as of now, tomorrow i'll be emailing him and letting him know that we aren't willing to pay a bill that isn't in our name and isn't in any way transparent...

As for the meters.. I believe there are actually 3, but there's only 1 bill... Which, as I've said, we have never seen.

But the thing that really got me fuming today is the text asking me to get a loan to pay back the "Debt".. To be honest, I've had enough.

princeofpounds

Then you could also take him to court for deposit non-protection with a possible 100-300£ penalty. Shame it wasn't a larger deposit in some way.

Don't feel you must do it tomorrow. I'd urge you to research until you are comfortable with any course of action.

Billy84_2

I'm emailing my local citizens advice to see if they can offer me any further help

ValHaller

Billy84 wrote: »

We only paid a small, nominal deposit when we moved in.. £100.. And i've never heard that it has been put into any sort of scheme..

Do you have a receipt or any proff of this?

princeofpounds wrote: »

Then you could also take him to court for deposit non-protection with a possible 100-300£ penalty. Shame it wasn't a larger deposit in some way.

More useful (as it is a relatively small deposit) not to raise a song and dance over it not being protected. The fact that it is not protected means that any S21 notice is invalid, I thought .....

bitsandpieces

Offer to pay off the debt immediately - as soon as he settles up the £100 per month arrears he owes you for flat-sitting services Seriously, though, if the rent included electric he can't suddenly decide you owe him £££s in arrears. Refusing to pay this non-debt might mean he evicts you, but I think it's the best option - if your landlord feels he can just make up debts from you to him and demand payment, what's to say he won't suddenly decide you owe him another £1k?

I'd get something in writing about what your current payment for electricity (and gas?) covers. Is it to cover 'normal' use, with possible top-ups if you use a lot, or does it cover everything? You'll also need to negotiate a reasonable amount - if there's gas on top, £60 sounds like a fair bit for a flat, but that's down to what you can agree with the landlord...