BACS PAYMENT - Scammed and desperately need help!

JSPENCER

agrinnall wrote: »

Every bank would have treated you in the same way, so I'm not sure what you think your hissy fit is going to achieve other than a bit of hassle switching your account (although if you are clever about it you could move to an account that pays you for switching to them and maybe recoup a bit of the money you're thrown away).

Oh, and it's not a BACS payment.

If you'd actually taken the time to read my post's, you'd realise I'm not having a hissy fit. you'd see that:
A) I'm passionate about good customer service, and RBS have not given this to me. Nothing to do with the process or what has happened. Changing accounts is no hassle at all, I have 4 direct debits to switch, and the new bank say they'll do this (even if they don't I'll happily call the companies to advise).

And The bank I've signed up with are giving me £125.

Thank you for your contribution to the thread, however.

dzug1 wrote: »

You seem to have found out who the recipient is - take them to court yourself?

The problem is, Co-Op Cash Plus have told me the account has been inactive for over 2 years, so there is a chance I'd be taking someone to court who stopped using a bank account over 2 years ago, and probably has no idea this is going on!

gb12345

JSPENCER wrote: »

They'd have no proof it was me that logged in and sent it, the only evidence suggesting it was me is the fact I've admitted to it, if I hadn't, I could have claimed otherwise..

Have you ever heard of a little thing called IP addresses - I assume that you didn't choose to make this one transfer from a totally different computer to the one you use for all your other online banking? They would be able to tell straight away that the transfer originated from a computer that has regularly been used to access online banking.

gb12345

JSPENCER wrote: »

The problem is, Co-Op Cash Plus have told me the account has been inactive for over 2 years, so there is a chance I'd be taking someone to court who stopped using a bank account over 2 years ago, and probably has no idea this is going on!

I am surprised that the Co-op have given you any information about the account - just by telling you the name of the account holder they have breached the DPA.

Also, how can the account be inactive if you (and many other people if the link you gave is to be believed) transferred money into it - where do you think that money went?

JSPENCER

gb12345 wrote: »

Have you ever heard of a little thing called IP addresses - I assume that you didn't choose to make this one transfer from a totally different computer to the one you use for all your other online banking? They would be able to tell straight away that the transfer originated from a computer that has regularly been used to access online banking.

IP addresses really exist? I thought they were just a rumour!!
Again, I was speaking hypothetically, it wasn't intended to be taken seriously.

gb12345 wrote: »

I am surprised that the Co-op have given you any information about the account - just by telling you the name of the account holder they have breached the DPA.

Also, how can the account be inactive if you (and many other people if the link you gave is to be believed) transferred money into it - where do you think that money went?

I know, it was very strange. I work with strict DPA rules myself and was a bit shocked he was freely giving the info away. He did sound like he felt sorry for me though, so it probably just slipped his mind.

I don't know enough about bank systems to give you an answer to your question, there must be a way for somebody working there to cover their tracks if information was being messed with? Who knows, purely speculating but this is the information Co-op gave to me..

gb12345

JSPENCER wrote: »

I don't know enough about bank systems to give you an answer to your question, there must be a way for somebody working there to cover their tracks if information was being messed with? Who knows, purely speculating but this is the information Co-op gave to me..

I can tell you for a fact that there is no way anyone within a bank (particularly non-IT staff) would be able to make any change to the underlying data for an account without leaving an audit trail.

Even at database level, updates to the data would be tracked to an individual user and there would be very few staff that would have that access level to a production system any way.

The_pc_tech

While I sympathise with your plight being told that their paypal account was 'playing up' would have raised a red flag to me as paypal may already have been suspicious and frozen the account, I would have probably abandoned the transaction then and there.

Agricolae

In my opinion you are outraged, not because the bank has refused to help claim the money back, but because you're annoyed at allowing yourself to be conned in the first place.

It happens and I think the best thing for you to do is to put it down to experience and move on.

However, if you want more information on why the bank has taken what appears to be an unhelpful position, read on.

Basically, you have an agreement with your bank that it will, unless it reasonably suspects the person giving it instructions is not you, act on your instructions to pay money from your account.

In this case, you were hoodwinked into sending a payment to some account details in exchange for tickets which were never provided. In order to do so with RBS, you would have needed to enter your customer number, part of your online PIN and part of your password to access digital banking. You would then have had to put your debit card in a card reader, enter your debit card PIN and confirm the transaction this way.

As you can see, you would have little chance of success in arguing that it was not you who authorised the payment initially, given the amount of security involved.

RBS has acted correctly in making the payment in accordance with your instructions. It has no liability in connection with the payment if it has followed your instructions accurately. For bank to bank transfers there is no framework for a bank to dispute a transaction where there is a disagreement between a buyer and a seller (like chargebacks for plastic cards, or section 75 for credit cards).

You do, however, have a claim against the person who has conned you, presuming you can find out who they are and bring a court action against them. This is not necessarily because of the fraud issue, but because you have evidence that you paid this person for tickets and this person did not provide you with any tickets (i.e. a breach of contract).

On the issue of customer service, I do not think RBS has done anything particularly wrong. They have tried to explain to you that they can't help but you haven't accepted what they're saying, so you've contacted them multiple times to raise the same issue and be told the same thing.

That said, I would have expected them to at least display some sympathy. Also, sending you to the branch when the branch couldn't help was not very helpful.

matttye

The_pc_tech wrote: »

While I sympathise with your plight being told that their paypal account was 'playing up' would have raised a red flag to me as paypal may already have been suspicious and frozen the account, I would have probably abandoned the transaction then and there.

Agreed - PayPal offers protection for these types of sales and the bank doesn't.

Whenever I sell on eBay I always list PayPal as a requirement and won't sell to anyone without it.

jonesMUFCforever

JSPENCER wrote: »

At no point have I claimed they have done anything wrong? I fully accept what the process is, but having lost £200, I'm sure you can empathise and understand my frustration.

My problem with the bank is their customer service, as it's quite clearly 5h1t, and as stated a couple of times that is my area of expertise and I hate bad customer service. The misinformation with regards 'what to do next' is my other issue, 'ring your branch..' no help.. 'ring the fraud team again'.. no help.. etc. Both valid reasons to whinge in my opinion.

Just to re-iterate, I fully understand the process, and can accept the bank want nothing to do with it, I think they should be more helpful though, and it's their SERVICE that has made me choose to close my account, not the process, as I know this would have happened with any bank.



I'm not suggesting doing it, I was speaking hypothetically.

What exactly do you want the bank to do then?

You have been told (and understand) that they cannot help you reverse the transaction - so what do you want them to do?

They cannot tell you the real name and address as this would be in breach of data protection laws even in a fraud case - so what do you want them to do?

What exact service do you think the bank should offer in this case? You are in customer services yourself so put ypurself in the bank's shoes and tell what they have done wrong for you to rate it as s*it?

To be honest they should have told you where to go in the first instance - that IMO would have been the proper and good service.

The_pc_tech

matttye wrote: »

Agreed - PayPal offers protection for these types of sales and the bank doesn't.

Whenever I sell on eBay I always list PayPal as a requirement and won't sell to anyone without it.

I did the same when I used to sell my old mobile phones on ebay but got fed up of having to deal with Nigerian fraudsters offering to pay double via Western Union.