Investigation?

Funky_Bold_Ribena

Usually, when people,don't want to disclose, it's because it's true. So until an adviser knows the full story, they are advising on incorrect assumptions. And hence wasting their time.

FBaby

What I'm not clear is what outcome you want out of it? Going back to your job as it was? Being offered another position, if so, do you know what that could be, what would be the restriction, whether it is indeed feasible (ie, is big boss being difficult or is it really the case there is no other post for you to move to)? Or do you want to make a deal for you to go (pay out, positive reference etc...).

You need to be clear what it is you are after.

zzzLazyDaisy

FBaby wrote: »

What I'm not clear is what outcome you want out of it? Going back to your job as it was? Being offered another position, if so, do you know what that could be, what would be the restriction, whether it is indeed feasible (ie, is big boss being difficult or is it really the case there is no other post for you to move to)? Or do you want to make a deal for you to go (pay out, positive reference etc...).

You need to be clear what it is you are after.

This is the best advice you've had so far on this thread (given the lack of detailed information).

For example, if you have given up on the whole deal and just want out of there on the best possible deal, then the advice will be different from the what it would be if you are fighting tooth and nail to keep your job.

One thing I would say is, don't get bogged down with the principles of the thing, or detail for detail's sake. Decide what out come you want and you'll have a clearer idea of how to work out a strategy to achieve this (if possible).

starlight123456

FBaby wrote: »

What I'm not clear is what outcome you want out of it? Going back to your job as it was? Being offered another position, if so, do you know what that could be, what would be the restriction, whether it is indeed feasible (ie, is big boss being difficult or is it really the case there is no other post for you to move to)? Or do you want to make a deal for you to go (pay out, positive reference etc...).

You need to be clear what it is you are after.

Well the saga continues.

I put my grievance in, and as requested stated I was following the grievance procedure and requested an informal mediation meeting as stated as first step in the procedure. Procedure also states mediation can be used at any stage.

They mucked about for four weeks with are you sure, hr person went on holiday and handed to someone else, then original hr person came back and said are you sure because you said you wanted a facilitated meeting and you have already had mediation etc etc

However, a facilitated meeting is different to a mediation meeting because mediation is voluntary and that is why it is in the grievance procedure, if not resolved informally via mediation withing five working days... move to formal stage one.

So, finally get a letter from BB's Boss saying mediation refused, options are a facilitated meeting or formal stage one, please respond by x (which would be less than five working days).

I have spoken to hr person to ask why are they so insistent on having a facilitated meeting (I have only been asking for this for four months and now I've raised a grievance they decide it is me who has changed my mind) when this is not part of procedure and also asked what would it involve, apparently it is to seek agreement that we can work together so I can return to my post and if this is not agreed I will be moved permanently... erm, no because that would not be fair. This meeting is to be attended by new manager, big boss and hr person plus union reps if needed.

I want to go back to my post and don't see how this needs to be agreed or why I should be the one to be moved if it supposedly can't?

I am concerned about agreeing to attend a facilitated meeting for reasons above (outcome is predetermined and not in my favour) but also concerned that refusing this will go against me. Apparently the new manager has refused mediation because they did not find the process useful last time?? Surely this shows they are not willing to voluntarily resolve any outstanding issues?

For goodness sake, should I just turn up at my usual job on Monday or what, this is way beyond ridiculous now.

I am wondering also how the three months time limit for ET is worked out, should I be putting this in now or is the situation still ongoing and how do I work out when I would need to do this?

Sorry for long ramble, I am really tired and hope someone can help?

ValHaller

LittleVoice wrote: »

However keeping the electronic copies at work is also important, especially if there is a policy about what can be kept privately.

As this material

• relates to the OP's employment contract, rather than to any task,
• will be addressed to OP personally rather than to a role within the company
• may potentially (but hopefully not) be required in legal proceedings

it is entirely justifiable to keep copies off site

ValHaller

starlight123456 wrote: »

Well the saga continues.


.....

I want to go back to my post and don't see how this needs to be agreed or why I should be the one to be moved if it supposedly can't?

......

This has been going so long now, with you suspended that I think we can make a little observation here, which is that someone is prepared to spend quite a lot of money in not having you working on your proper job.

With no clues as to how old and new roles relate and the implications for you (fair enough), it is not realistic to comment on the extent to which you should try swimming against the tide. But you do need to acknowledge that there are significant forces opposing your desire to return.

Overall, I am inclined to suggest that you ask to defer your decision on the facilitated meeting and ask for a meeting between yourself, a HR rep and the external Union rep to map out the options for moving forward. If this is accepted, do not be surprised if there is a separate meeting between the Union rep and the HR rep either immediately before or immediately after.

Out of this, I think HR will tell you in a fairly measured way either directly or via your rep how the land lies and what issues need to be addressed, particularly if you can frame your aspirations in terms of expectation of the characteristics of a role rather than in terms of a return to a particular position.

Firefox1975

OP - how do you know your new manager "obviously doesn;t like you? " what a ridiculous thing to say.

more likely your new manager doesn't like your attitude. (This would make more sense)

i infer from this that being new they have tried to implement new things in the office whether thats for work or the ambience and you have taken afront that they should try and change the "status quo" and therefore been a difficult member of staff to deal with. i.e jobsworth.

Now , higher up the chain your new manager will have been given a plan of action in his new role and you are now apparently standing in the way of what the powers that be want.

You cannot win - i hope you get your role back, but dont be surprised that it changes to another situation that you dont like and becomes your reason for living to constantly fight your employer. Life is too short.

Sometimes it is better to jump into change before you are pushed... it look better.

starlight123456

ValHaller wrote: »

This has been going so long now, with you suspended that I think we can make a little observation here, which is that someone is prepared to spend quite a lot of money in not having you working on your proper job.

With no clues as to how old and new roles relate and the implications for you (fair enough), it is not realistic to comment on the extent to which you should try swimming against the tide. But you do need to acknowledge that there are significant forces opposing your desire to return.

Overall, I am inclined to suggest that you ask to defer your decision on the facilitated meeting and ask for a meeting between yourself, a HR rep and the external Union rep to map out the options for moving forward. If this is accepted, do not be surprised if there is a separate meeting between the Union rep and the HR rep either immediately before or immediately after.

Out of this, I think HR will tell you in a fairly measured way either directly or via your rep how the land lies and what issues need to be addressed, particularly if you can frame your aspirations in terms of expectation of the characteristics of a role rather than in terms of a return to a particular position.

Thanks VH. I know I am being quite vague, public forum and all that but honestly I have not done anything to warrant this treatment, this kind of behaviour is rife in this organisation, in the relatively short time I have been here there are at least five other similar cases to this going on that I know of. It appears to be a tried and tested formula, unfortunately I have put up more of a fight than others and they now do not know how to deal with me. Most people end up off sick and I haven't done this but in fact continued to produce good work and have this in writing from several colleagues. Once people are off then it is easy for them to say oh right ok well then heres another job now you don't have to go back with that nasty lot, off you go run along now ... until they then start on the next one.

I feel in a very vulnerable place right now and especially since the person I have been allocated to and who has previously given me very good praise and feedback is the union rep for the new manager, now since I put my complaint in this has all changed and this person is now complaining to their boss about me claiming I am doing all the same things as the investigation was about and making a big fuss about it, however this has included verbally abusing me in front of other staff and giving me constantly changing instructions then claiming I am not doing any work and they do not know where I am (this person has access to my outlook calendar). I have reported this and today been asked what action I want to take over it which is a difficult one.

If you have any thoughts on that I would be very interested!

If people are not willing to attend mediation then what are the chances of a facilitated meeting having a positive outcome? I will be chasing the external union rep however they are good frieds with the person above who is making a fuss so possibly I need to ask for this to be taken on by someone else.

Firefox, thank you for your comments, however, unsuprisingly I do find them upsetting. All I can say is I can see what you are saying however even if what you are saying were the case, the persistent actions taken against me are a bit drastic under any / the circumstances to say the least.

ValHaller

starlight123456 wrote: »

I feel in a very vulnerable place right now and especially since the person I have been allocated to and who has previously given me very good praise and feedback is the union rep for the new manager, now since I put my complaint in this has all changed and this person is now complaining to their boss about me claiming I am doing all the same things as the investigation was about and making a big fuss about it, however this has included verbally abusing me in front of other staff and giving me constantly changing instructions then claiming I am not doing any work and they do not know where I am (this person has access to my outlook calendar). I have reported this and today been asked what action I want to take over it which is a difficult one.

You should not be dealing with your union rep through company machinery. Sure they are compromised. But you should ignore them in the company context and work through full time reps

starlight123456

ValHaller wrote: »

You should not be dealing with your union rep through company machinery. Sure they are compromised. But you should ignore them in the company context and work through full time reps

Thnks but that is not my union rep, this person is supposedly managing me and is representing the new manager as their union rep and so has a conflict of interest. My union rep is external but a friend of this person (same union too). So too many divided loyalties and conflicts of interests and there are more which I haven't gone into here. Hard to ignore this person when they are making my life difficult on a daily basis at a sensitive time. I need to decide whether to make another formal complaint, I have witnesses and evidence.