'A generation of Muslims not able to go to university?' blog discussion

jamesd

Figgerty wrote: »

The other religions just go about their business without complaint and seem to have little problems living under our laws.

You might find it useful to compare abortion law in Northern Ireland with that in the rest of the country. It's a crime there in most cases.

Finding a funding method not involving interest for Muslims doesn't come close to the way that NI special case restricts those of different beliefs.

statistic

Going to university with £9,000 plus a year tuition fees and rising cost of student living has become a privilege only for the few, however add to that a usurious system with compound interest, and you've limited more of the people that thought they could (and even if they do, you tie their hands and feet together in a lifetime of debt). Education should be a right to everyone. This is not about muslim and non-muslim, this is a class debate and always has been. Ban lifetime debt, ban commercial interest on student loans, and lower tuition fees for students!

statistic

Figgerty wrote: »

Why is it almost always the muslims that have problems with our law or culture.

A subdued nation which lets government and big business take away life, liberty and freedom is what we should fear... not Muslims and their 'oh so terrible' ways. If you don't have a problem with the way the system is being managed, and the way we as a community are headed, then there is something severely wrong with you (and not even big pharma's anti-depressants will be able to cure you).

Fire_Fox

Figgerty wrote: »

I have only recently found out that christians are forbidden from collecting together to practice their religion in some Muslim countries. No churches are allowed and those who want to practice their religion have to do so in private. Contrast that with all the allowances we make in the UK for other religions. I say let them fit in with our laws.

Who is this 'we' and 'them' and 'other'?

Surprising facts: plenty of British Muslims are born here as were their parents, plenty of yes even WHITE!! UK citizens don't identify as Christian nor find religious divides either productive or in any way spiritual. You honestly think a God who loves all humankind wants religious segregation, holy wars, petty playground tit-for-tat, differentiates between a church and a mosque? Really??

Are you saying because the culture in many countries is deeply oppressive to certain groups we should be sure to do the opposite? So women, homosexuals and Jews are in charge in your utopian UK then? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1divI2HcVPM

Fire_Fox

"The Ipsos MORI poll in 2003 reported that 18% were "a practising member of an organised religion".[39] The Tearfund Survey in 2007 found that only 7% of the population considered themselves as practising Christians. Ten per cent attend church weekly and two-thirds had not gone to church in the past year.[46][49] The Tearfund Survey also found that two thirds of UK adults (66%) or 32.2 million people have no connection with the Church at present (nor with another religion). These people were evenly divided between those who have been in the past but have since left (16 million) and those who have never been in their lives (16.2 million).
Currently, regular church attendance in the United Kingdom stands at 6% of the population with the average age of the attendee being 51. This shows a decline in church attendance since 1980 when regular attendance stood at 11% with an average age of 37. It is predicted that by 2020, attendance will be around 4% with an average age of 56.[48] This decline in church attendance has forced many churches to close down across the United Kingdom with the Church of England alone being forced to close 1,500 churches between 1969 and 2002. Their fates include dereliction, demolition and residential conversion.[50] ....

One study shows that in 2004 at least 930,000 Muslims attended a mosque at least once a week, just outnumbering the 916,000 regular church goers in the Church of England.[54]Muslim sources claim the number of practicing Muslims is underestimated as many of them pray at home.[55]"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_in_the_United_Kingdom

Figgerty

jamesd wrote: »

You might find it useful to compare abortion law in Northern Ireland with that in the rest of the country. It's a crime there in most cases.

Finding a funding method not involving interest for Muslims doesn't come close to the way that NI special case restricts those of different beliefs.

If you live in NI and are denied an abortion you will have to accept that law or move elsewhere. That is what living under the laws of the land entails.

Finding a way around not paying 'interest' but still paying off a loan with a fee included (paying back the full amount) is the same as not eating pork but instead eaingt pork sausages - that is still eating pork.

Figgerty

Fire_Fox wrote: »

Who is this 'we' and 'them' and 'other'?

Surprising facts: plenty of British Muslims are born here as were their parents, plenty of yes even WHITE!! UK citizens don't identify as Christian nor find religious divides either productive or in any way spiritual. You honestly think a God who loves all humankind wants religious segregation, holy wars, petty playground tit-for-tat, differentiates between a church and a mosque? Really??

Are you saying because the culture in many countries is deeply oppressive to certain groups we should be sure to do the opposite? So women, homosexuals and Jews are in charge in your utopian UK then? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1divI2HcVPM

A god who is supposed to love all is not going to punish the few who take out a loan for their education. This loan is legal under the laws of the land.

There is nothing wrong with having women, homosexuals or Jews in charge of the UK, in fact the UK did very well under a woman PM.

Figgerty

Fire_Fox wrote: »

"The Ipsos MORI poll in 2003 reported that 18% were "a practising member of an organised religion".[39] The Tearfund Survey in 2007 found that only 7% of the population considered themselves as practising Christians. Ten per cent attend church weekly and two-thirds had not gone to church in the past year.[46][49] The Tearfund Survey also found that two thirds of UK adults (66%) or 32.2 million people have no connection with the Church at present (nor with another religion). These people were evenly divided between those who have been in the past but have since left (16 million) and those who have never been in their lives (16.2 million).
Currently, regular church attendance in the United Kingdom stands at 6% of the population with the average age of the attendee being 51. This shows a decline in church attendance since 1980 when regular attendance stood at 11% with an average age of 37. It is predicted that by 2020, attendance will be around 4% with an average age of 56.[48] This decline in church attendance has forced many churches to close down across the United Kingdom with the Church of England alone being forced to close 1,500 churches between 1969 and 2002. Their fates include dereliction, demolition and residential conversion.[50] ....

One study shows that in 2004 at least 930,000 Muslims attended a mosque at least once a week, just outnumbering the 916,000 regular church goers in the Church of England.[54]Muslim sources claim the number of practicing Muslims is underestimated as many of them pray at home.[55]"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_in_the_United_Kingdom

Many people of religion only go to Church/Chapel for births, marriages and deaths but they also pray at home. They would categorise themselves as Christian in a census. You do not have to go to Church to pray, a conversation with God can take place anywhere. A great number of younger people are reluctant to admit to praying as it is not fashionable to do so.

seven-day-weekend

If they do not believe in borrowing money at interest, sobeit, the Muslim community themselves should deal with this and make provision. The law of the land should not be changed to suit a tiny minority of students.

statistic

seven-day-weekend wrote: »

If they do not believe in borrowing money at interest, sobeit, the Muslim community themselves should deal with this and make provision. The law of the land should not be changed to suit a tiny minority of students.

the law of the land should encompass the views, and fulfill the need of all, *especially* the minority (who btw in this case equal ~ 3million). By overlooking the minority opens the door for injustice, intolerance, and prejudice.

Anyway - what happened to respect, empathy and understanding for fellow people? Or have we all turned into neo-juggernauts who want everyone to follow us and all?