Town & City ticket... Help please!

nurseymcnurse

Thanks again for your responses. I wrote a letter to M&S CEO yesterday, so will post today & await any response... Next is to write the POPLA appeal. I think the point about lost earnings is a good one, and one that I made in my letter to TCP. The fact that the car park I parked in was free, surely means they have no grounds to 'charge' me as they lost no income. I will try to post my letter on here once it's written (if I can work out how to).

AltheHibby

Nursey,

If you are composing it on a PC it might be just as easy to copy and paste on to here. Don't forget to remove the personal details when you post.

Stroma

We can help you with that if you wish, remember though that popla decisions are not binding on you no matter what the outcome is.

ManxRed

And the one thing POPLA DO seem to go for is when you query whether the PPC's contract with the landowner confers sufficient rights on the PPC to offer parking and form a contract with a driver in the first place.

So make sure you bung that in.

atilla

Just remember that no company name who may hold a contract with Asda or M&A is mentioned on the sign so no contract can be made.

nurseymcnurse

Hi All,
I have had a reply from M&S CEO's office (not the man himself). They say:
" The car park is not owned or administered by M&S, and we aren't able to overturn any parking tickets"
They have given me the landlords and owners name- Jones Lang Lasalle. I have also been given a contact email address for someone there.

I am starting to feel a bit overwhelmed when I read all these very lengthy letters and legal cases . I have read the VCS v HMRC (2012) which does seem to be relevant in my case. I just have no idea how lengthy a response I should be making to POPLA... this is what I have so far, which is basically what you kind people have offered. Any suggestions welcome. I also need help/clarification on a few points:
1. do I need to give them the blurb about why I parked in the disabled bay in the first place? Or do I just presume they know that already?
2. Coupon-mad, I'm not sure how to get the bit in about feeding my son... and yes, I was breastfeeding at the time.
3. Should I argue about VAT? There is a company VAT No. printed on the back of the ticket, but no VAT amount shown on the charge side.

This is my letter of appeal so far...
!

[FONT=Arial, sans-serif][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]The law states (Unfair Contract Terms Act 1997):[/FONT][/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif][FONT=Arial, sans-serif] [/FONT][/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif][FONT=Arial, sans-serif] “Terms may be unfair if they have the object or effect requiring any consumer who fails to fulfill his obligation to pay a disproportionate high sum in compensation”[/FONT][/FONT]


[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]The Fountains Retail Park does not require purchase of a parking ticket to park there, therefore I don't believe any contract was made between myself and Town & City Parking. If a contract exists, and that contract is between myself and Town & City Parking, the terms are unfair because the charge does not represent a genuine pre-estimate of the parking company's losses, and is thus a penalty.[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]As there is no contract, I would be at most guilty of the tort of trespass. Were this the case, my sole liability would be damages in favour of the landowner. As the car park was not in full occupation when I parked there, I dispute that the landowner incurred any losses. Furthermore, this is non-charging car park so the 'parking charge notice' that I have received can only be seen as a penalty fine which is against the BPA Code of Practice.[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]I would also query whether the private parking company's contract with the landowner confers sufficient rights for them to offer parking on this land thereby forming a contract with the driver. Town & City Parking did not have a lawful right of occupation or possessory title which would give it the legal standing to offer parking or allege contracts, or claim any loss of earnings for trespass, as in the case of VCS v HMRC (2012).[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]A contract can only be made where both parties are able to negotiate the terms of the contract; where an offer is made, and acceptance of that offer then takes place. It is unfair if both parties are unable to negotiate the terms of the contract.[/FONT]


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Coupon-mad

nurseymcnurse wrote: »

2. Coupon-mad, I'm not sure how to get the bit in about feeding my son... and yes, I was breastfeeding at the time.

I say that should be the first point in your appeal to POPLA because a nursing mother is covered by the Equality Act 2010 and they cannot harass you over this if you tell them/POPLA the facts.

Already summed up in Browndog's case on pepipoo, similar issue only an overstay (I seem to recall yours was for parking in a disabled bay which was the wrong thing to do, and more difficult for you now TBH, but I don't think it's insurmountable). Browndog's thread:

http://forums.pepipoo.com/index.php?showtopic=74849

http://www.babyfeedinglawgroup.org.uk/thelaw/feedinginpublic

The Equality Act 2010 makes it an offence to harass or discriminate against a breastfeeding mother. Trouble is you were in a disabled bay not overstaying but I would still lead with the 'harassment of a nursing mother when there was nowhere else to stop to breastfeed the baby...breach of Equality Act 2010' and enclose that printout (second link) in case Shona at POPLA isn't overly familiar with that specific part of the law.

I am not sure you need to say what 'the law states' as regards unfair contracts, I suspect Shona the adjudicator knows what it states. Alleged unfair contracts would also be a breach of CPUTR (Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations 2008) as well - so you don't have to actually quote from the law, just say the ticket breaches those laws.

You could add that pursuing a ticket is patently unfair in your specific case as no 'reasonable adjustment' has been made for you (did the parking firm know you are a breastfeeding mother though?). If you told the PPC at all then IMHO they should have cancelled the fake PCN as it is harassment of you now.

It's a bit late at night now and I am away for a day or two on a course, but I also suggest your paragraphs need a re-jig because the 'As there is no contract...' paragraph seems more suitable as the conclusion at the end.

AltheHibby

This mob are still not compliant with the law. I have just reported them to dvla for threatening civil penalties in Edinburgh.

Thats the type of peopleyou are dealing with.

nurseymcnurse

I contacted the landowner yesterday and he has instructed TCP to cancel my ticket....:T

Thank you to all who have helped me, it's much appreciated.