Daughter 11 wants to go on a Christian camp

suki1001

pigpen wrote: »

If you disagree with your daughter being ambushed by the teachings at a camp then surely you realise the drip..drip..drip.. every week at the youth club will be more influential?

You get told repeatedly in one day you are worthless you shrug it off but if you are told it daily/weekly for years you start believing it.. I'd look at finding a different youth group if you do not agree with the teachings of this particular establishment.

Maybe something like guides would be more suitable, they have the trips away and the weekly group meetings... though I think they are nuts too lol.

Looking at the site for SS I wouldn't let them go because they all look like drug crazed nutjobs in the pics.. Have you seen the leaders??? :eek:

The leaders from our groups go with the children and run the activities unless they are specialist ones.. orienteering for example. I don't think I would be ok with people I did not know having an influence on my children.

Well, it's only since I've looked into this trip that I've considered that attending the group might be a problem. The group are really nice. I know they do a little bit of bible study, but the rest of the time it's games and fun things. They are very welcoming and there's no pressure to go to church etc, so it's seemed quite harmless, i honestly don't think it's any different to other church youth groups.

The other thing I've always liked about the group is that there is none of the cliquiness (?) that you can get with other groups, so up until now, I've been quite happy with the ethos. We've tried brownies, girls brigade, the local children's theatre, sea cadets and they weren't for my dd. It's been quite difficult to find something that she's wanted to continue to go to.

So the answer is I'm now not sure whether it is a good idea for her to continue, but I'm not sure I have an alternative. She enjoys it. She'll be aware now that we disagree about some of the things and I don't want her to feel torn.

Mojisola

pigpen wrote: »

If you disagree with your daughter being ambushed by the teachings at a camp then surely you realise the drip..drip..drip.. every week at the youth club will be more influential?

You get told repeatedly in one day you are worthless you shrug it off but if you are told it daily/weekly for years you start believing it..

suki1001 wrote: »

Well, it's only since I've looked into this trip that I've considered that attending the group might be a problem. The group are really nice. I know they do a little bit of bible study, but the rest of the time it's games and fun things. They are very welcoming and there's no pressure to go to church etc, so it's seemed quite harmless, i honestly don't think it's any different to other church youth groups.

Only if no-one else is telling you different. Any subliminal messages that are given out at the weekly meetings can easily be balanced by the messages suki gives out at home.

As long as the daughter has reasonable self-esteem and is able to discuss any teachings that come up at the groups with her parents, things can be kept in balance.

suki1001

Mojisola wrote: »

Only if no-one else is telling you different. Any subliminal messages that are given out at the weekly meetings can easily be balanced by the messages suki gives out at home.

As long as the daughter has reasonable self-esteem and is able to discuss any teachings that come up at the groups with her parents, things can be kept in balance.

I just remembered actually, I asked my dad who's a psychologist (and staunchly aethiest) when she started going whether it was likely she could be heavily influenced and his opinion was that as we both don't go to any church etc - that it was unlikely, it's more when the family re-inforces that view.

pigpen

Mojisola wrote: »

Only if no-one else is telling you different. Any subliminal messages that are given out at the weekly meetings can easily be balanced by the messages suki gives out at home.

As long as the daughter has reasonable self-esteem and is able to discuss any teachings that come up at the groups with her parents, things can be kept in balance.

I don't think that is true.. many people have had a few hours with someone negative who has had greater influence than the people who love them.. or a family member/husband friend who has made nasty remarks and they start believing it. At this age the parents probably have the greater influence but they won't in a year or 2 when parents just know nothing.

amus

When I see high pressure Christian camps like SS, all I can think of is the Jonestown massacre. IMO that tradgedy just goes to show how easily apparently normal people can be manipulated into completely abnormal behaviour, all at the hands of a charismatic nut job or two (which, sorry if it offends, is all I see leaders of these 'churches' as).

As an atheist I can for the most part accept mainstream Christianity as relatively harmless, but groups like this are nothing short of dangerous IMHO.

surfboard2

Does your daughter actually attend the Church or just the youth club?

I agree with pigpen in regards to the influence of the youth club. If SS is an issue, then i'd have thought the youth club should be an issue too.

suki1001

simply_tash wrote: »

Does your daughter actually attend the Church or just the youth club?

I agree with pigpen in regards to the influence of the youth club. If SS is an issue, then i'd have thought the youth club should be an issue too.

No, she doesn't go to church. The SS issue came after. Like I said my dad sort of put any concerns to bed. They are concerns I'd have had with any church group though.

The fact is I know plenty of youngsters who went to that church who no longer practice and I've been to lots of other things they've done, such as fundays and not felt uncomfortable. It only seems when you're fully involved with them that you see the wacky bits and I didn't think they'd be speaking in tongues at the youth group.

There are 2 sides to this church. The community bit is very gentle, which is where I'd place the youth group.

claire16c

Brighton_belle wrote: »

Would you not? I seem to know quite a few, given I am not one. I just think calling it a cult is incorrect as they are always popping up on songs of praise and I see them as no different to Billy Graham, or at least one of the recent arch bish candidates.

I don't want to be seen as in a position of 'defending' lol, that would be quite ironic given my experience, it's just there is lot lot of this style of worship around.

I believe the Quakers have their name because when they started, they used to shake and quake with the power of the holy sprit, just as people might see at one of these meetings now.

I guess I don't think of it as mainstream because the people who go to these type of churches, their entire world seems to revolve around it. As opposed to someone who is c of e or catholic for example who you could probably in some cases have no idea whether they were religious or not.

The ones I've met tend to have friendship groups that are 99% made up from people from their church. Some of them actually work for the church as a full time job. They go to bible/class things mid week, church on a Sunday, run or went to camps like SS in the summer and probably more!

I've been to a couple of weddings & I came away wondering if Id just been to watch a couple get married or some kind of extended all day church service.

They also seem to be more likely to be homophobic, pressure people into not having sex before marriage & therefore marrying young in the first relationship so they can have sex, all sorts.

My friend probably only has a hand ful of non religious friends who she met at school or are family members. I've never heard of her meeting anyone new who isn't in her religious group.

I think the only reason I myself know quite a few, is that this one friend is one, and so through her I've sometimes been introduced to her non school/uni friends and every single one of them is from church. It's quite an insular lifestyle if that's the right word.

Mojisola

claire16c wrote: »

I think the only reason I myself know quite a few, is that this one friend is one, and so through her I've sometimes been introduced to her non school/uni friends and every single one of them is from church. It's quite an insular lifestyle if that's the right word.

I know someone who had been introduced to a friend of a friend and got on really well with him. It came up in conversation that he didn't go to their church (in fact, wasn't part of any religion) and she was totally shocked - "But he must be part of our church, he's such a good person!"

Brain-washed or what? People who aren't part of our group can't be good people. It's alarming that people really think like that.

claire16c

Mojisola wrote: »

I know someone who had been introduced to a friend of a friend and got on really well with him. It came up in conversation that he didn't go to their church (in fact, wasn't part of any religion) and she was totally shocked - "But he must be part of our church, he's such a good person!"

Brain-washed or what? People who aren't part of our group can't be good people. It's alarming that people really think like that.

Same as when people say you need religion/bible to follow the rules/ have morals.

Like non religious people don't have morals...