Audi finance ppi claim

barmybanker

Please help. I sent a complaint to Audi Finance with regards to claiming ppi back from 2007. The letter was sent in October 2012 and they have just sent their final reply saying that they were not going to pay out as I would not have been missold. When I took the finance they did not give me the option of not having payment protection nor did they tell me what it would cover. Do you think I would get anywhere with the Ombudsmen?
Apart from the fact they sent me numerous letters telling me they were investigating my complaint on non letter headed paper, not once did they tell me when I would expect to get a final response. I thought that they had 8 weeks to make a decision. I dont expect a fortune but dont feel that they have taken this seriously. What should I do?

[Deleted User]

barmybanker wrote: »

Apart from the fact they sent me numerous letters telling me they were investigating my complaint on non letter headed paper, not once did they tell me when I would expect to get a final response. I thought that they had 8 weeks to make a decision.

Lenders aren't obliged to respond within eight weeks at all, but they have certainly agreed to and they know that if they don't then the complainant gains the right to go to the Ombudsman after this period.

If they sent you "numerous" letters informing you that their investigation was ongoing then they seem to have treated you fairly by keeping you constantly informed.

As for your actual PPI complaint, you can now refer it to the Ombudsman if you want. However, your reasons for complaint seem weak and you'll wait for more than a year with no guarantees of success.

Brains64

barmybanker wrote: »

Please help. I sent a complaint to Audi Finance with regards to claiming ppi back from 2007. The letter was sent in October 2012 and they have just sent their final reply saying that they were not going to pay out as I would not have been missold. When I took the finance they did not give me the option of not having payment protection nor did they tell me what it would cover. Do you think I would get anywhere with the Ombudsmen?
Apart from the fact they sent me numerous letters telling me they were investigating my complaint on non letter headed paper, not once did they tell me when I would expect to get a final response. I thought that they had 8 weeks to make a decision. I dont expect a fortune but dont feel that they have taken this seriously. What should I do?

Hi barmy, can I ask you, did Audi Finance explain in any detail why the complaint was not upheld??, for example, if you told them that you weren't given the option of having the insurance or not then did they show any evidence that you did agree to have it??

[Deleted User]

Brains64 wrote: »

did Audi Finance explain in any detail why the complaint was not upheld??,

"Full and final" responses where the complaint is rejected always give details of why.
It is only where the complaint is upheld that lenders are reticent to explain exactly why.
Remember also, that Banks don't have to provide proof against allegations made against them, the onus is on the complainant to do that. In law, "he who asserts must prove". This is the reason "hearsay" complaints where neither side can provide evidence are universally rejected unless other faults are found during the investigation (or there is an auto-payout).

Brains64

Moneyineptitude wrote: »

"Full and final" responses where the complaint is rejected always give details of why.
It is only where the complaint is upheld that lenders are reticent to explain exactly why.
Remember also, that Banks don't have to provide proof against allegations made against them, the onus is on the complainant to do that. In law, "he who asserts must prove". This is the reason "hearsay" complaints where neither side can provide evidence are universally rejected unless other faults are found during the investigation (or there is an auto-payout).

Yes I thought as much but the OP didn't give anything of what was said in the rejection letter, to get any help here they ought to give some idea what the rejection letter said, this would tell us the likelyhood of whether they are wasting their time taking it further or not.

[Deleted User]

Brains64 wrote: »

to get any help here they ought to give some idea what the rejection letter said, this would tell us the likelyhood of whether they are wasting their time taking it further or not.

I gleaned enough from his post that he complained that he thought the insurance was compulsory, so it's reasonable to assume that Audi have responded that their documentation and sales script show otherwise. A standard complaint with a standard response I would have thought. He can refer this to FOS if he wants to.

The Op seemed more concerned with the delayed "full and final" response and the fact that the letters he received weren't on letterheads. Neither are relevant to the success or failure of his PPI mis-selling complaint.

Stupid_Question

Moneyineptitude wrote: »

Lenders aren't obliged to respond within eight weeks at all, but they know that if they don't then the complainant gains the right to go to the Ombudsman after this period.

They are:

The respondent must, by the end of eight weeks after its receipt of the complaint, send the complainant:
(1) 2, 3a 'final response', being a written response from the respondent which:2, 3

(a) accepts the complaint and, where appropriate, offers redress or remedial action; or

(b) offers redress or remedial action without accepting the complaint; or

(c) rejects the complaint and gives reasons for doing so;

and which:
(d) encloses a copy of the Financial Ombudsman Service's standard explanatory leaflet; and

(e) informs the complainant that if he remains dissatisfied with the respondent's response, he may now refer his complaint to the Financial Ombudsman Service and must do so within six months; or

(2) a written response which:

(a) explains why it is not in a position to make a final response and indicates when it expects to be able to provide one;

(b) informs the complainant that he may now refer the complaint to the Financial Ombudsman Service; and

(c) encloses a copy of the Financial Ombudsman Service standard explanatory leaflet.

If your not happy now, speak to FOS, also raise that they have taken 4 months to issue their final response.

[Deleted User]

Stupid_Question wrote: »

They are:

As I said, the only sanction against them taking longer than the eight weeks is that the complainant can immediately go to FOS if no response is received within this timescale.
The OP chose not to go to FOS after the eight weeks.

There are plenty of examples, like this one, where the lender has failed to keep to the agreed schedule.

The FSA actually extended the eight week period for a time last year when Banks complained that they were too swamped to cope.

Complaining to FOS now about how long it took will not change the outcome of the PPI complaint.

Stupid_Question wrote: »

raise that they have taken 4 months to issue their final response.

This is an excessive length of time, I agree, but the OP says he has had "numerous" letters from Audi explaining the delay. I'm not sure what action the Ombudsman could take against Audi for this.

barmybanker

First letter received dated 6/11/12 from VW Financial Services confirming receipt and stated that they would investigate issues and respond within 8 weeks. Second letter dated 29th Nov from Audi Finance again thanking me for my enquiry and stating that they didnt deal with the selling of Audi Finance ppi and so forwarded my letter to Teesside Audi. Third letter dated 17th Dec (blank paper) writing in response to my letter and to confirm that the matter is receiving attention and enclosed a copy of their complaints procedure (Financial Ombudsman leaflet) it was signed "Colebrook & Burgess Ltd???? Fourth letter dated 9th Jan again blank paper again acknowledging receipt and again confirming the matter is receiving attention and again enclosing complaints procedure. This was signed by a guy from Teesside Audi. Fifth and final letter dated 11th Feb "Final response letter" Finally on letter head
"Further to our letter dated 9th Jan I confirm that our investigations have been concluded. Whilst due to the passage of time since settlement of your agreement we no longer have the FSA paperwork completed at the point of sale we would wish to reassure you as follows. Our Business Managers are highly trained in finance and insurance matters and we are confident that the policy was explained to you in detail. At the time he would have assessed your need for the product and supplied you with original demands and needs questionnaire and statement for your records. Under no circumstances would you have been led to believe that ppi was a pre condition of the loan. On the finance agreement there is a specific question which states "do you want to apply for Audi ppi?" Such a question would not be required unless taking the cover was optional. Prior to the conclusion of the contract you were also supplied with detailed explanation of the cover and a copy of the key facts policy summary information. We therefore see no evidence in this case of the product having been mis-sold and have no offer to make"
The only needs the sales guy assessed was "did we need the car? At no point did he take me through why I needed the ppi or if I even needed it or if I had adequate cover already or what the payments would be without it. I sent them a letter dated 19th Jan (hand delivered) stating that I had not had a response nor had I had a response which would give me an estimated timescale on how long it would take them. I also stated that they were outside the timescale quoted by their complaints policy. All the guy was bothered about was getting his quota reached for that day and definitely not my personal circumstances.

barmybanker

They did not explain their delay either.

Stupid_Question

First letter received dated 6/11/12 from VW Financial Services confirming receipt and stated that they would investigate issues and respond within 8 weeks.

They have acknowledged your complaint.

Second letter dated 29th Nov from Audi Finance again thanking me for my enquiry and stating that they didnt deal with the selling of Audi Finance ppi and so forwarded my letter to Teesside Audi.

This is your first final response, you complained to the wrong place.

Third letter dated 17th Dec (blank paper) writing in response to my letter and to confirm that the matter is receiving attention and enclosed a copy of their complaints procedure (Financial Ombudsman leaflet) it was signed "Colebrook & Burgess Ltd????

I'm unsure why they are giving you a FOS leaflet at this stage but this would be them acknowleging your complaint.

Fourth letter dated 9th Jan again blank paper again acknowledging receipt and again confirming the matter is receiving attention and again enclosing complaints procedure.

They are obliged to write to you during the complaint to keep you abreast of the investigation, in practice this is usually sent at 4 weeks in advising that the complaint is still under investigation.

This was signed by a guy from Teesside Audi. Fifth and final letter dated 11th Feb "Final response letter" Finally on letter head

That's the final response to your complaint - 8 weeks (ish) after they acknowledged it on 17/12/12.

The only needs the sales guy assessed was "did we need the car? At no point did he take me through why I needed the ppi or if I even needed it or if I had adequate cover already or what the payments would be without it. I sent them a letter dated 19th Jan (hand delivered) stating that I had not had a response nor had I had a response which would give me an estimated timescale on how long it would take them. I also stated that they were outside the timescale quoted by their complaints policy. All the guy was bothered about was getting his quota reached for that day and definitely not my personal circumstances.

They have responded in the correct timescales. Letters coming on non headed paper is a bit of a non issue, its the content of the letter that's important not the presentation.

If they had to fill out a demands and needs statement then it's highly unlikely that you were mis sold. Your now alleging that that the salesman has completed it completely without your knowledge, of which you have no proof and neither do they. Escalate the complaint to FOS if you want. I don't see them upholding it though.

As I said, the only sanction against them taking longer than the eight weeks is that the complainant can immediately go to FOS if no response is received within this timescale.
The OP chose not to go to FOS after the eight weeks.

There are plenty of examples, like this one, where the lender has failed to keep to the agreed schedule.

FOS actually extended the eight week period for a time last year when Banks complained that they were too swamped to cope.

Complaining to FOS now about how long it took will not change the outcome of the PPI complaint.

The FOS does not set these timescales, the FSA does and the FSA will intervene if complaints are being routinely mismanaged.

A common misconception is that the FOS are a regulator and lenders are somehow scared of them.

The FOS is an adjudicator, nothing more.