Becoming a broker (to the brokers here)

dunstonh

Self employed is not the way for any new starter in to the industry and advising. I can say this with complete confidence.

I totally agree. Just because you have passed the rather easy exams, doesnt mean you know the job. That will take another year or two and you do not want to be taking on financial and personal liability for the advice you give in those early years.

Self employed means you pay the redress in any complaint.

You may think or get told that I was unsuccessful because I was unable to sell - that is not the case, I regularly write 3 cases a week minimum usually 4 or 5 and I have a good protection ratio to these too. I would write more if I had the admin support but my refusal to work 100 hours per week means that I am working to capacity at the moment. Burnout in the industry is common so do not think that its me being lazy by refusing to work as long as I can.

Very similar situation to me. I earned what i needed and no more. I was top quartile in the performance leagues which kept me safe and meant I earned well. If I had a big week, I would hold the figures back and come in with the required amount every week without fail. Employers (salesforce) want to bleed you dry. So play the game.

Sit that next to someone like me for example and I say, "I have had 11 years in the industry and have worked for many reputable companies like XYZ in various capacities." or someone like Andrew Smith who will say that he has had many more years than I have or my father in law who is an IFA with mortgage experience over over 25 years. Do you think your potential client will want to pay a fee for your offering?

Totally agree. Ok, on the IFA side it probably matters more as you can evidence portfolios that have been running much longer and show real data rather than hypothetical based on hindsight. However, you speak with a new client who asks questions about you (and they do) and experience counts. However, I dont recall ever being asked about experience during my employed days.

MortgageMamma

Well I just want to say that if someone is employed or self employed it really doesnt matter to me, I think employed is best for a new adviser but I don't think suceeding in a SE capacity is impossible - I am living proof of that, I worked as an EE for 4 months before becoming a 100% self generating SE for a DA

However, in doing that I learned the hard way and the most important thing any adviser needs to be able to do in order to suceed is draw on the support of those more experienced, and know where to find stuff out which you won't find in lender literature. To anyone going SE I would give the following advice:

1. See as many lender BDM's as possible. Not only is this good for your CPD it is a real eye opener on their products. Develop strong relationships with BDMs and never look down your nose or shut your ears when they are trying to sell the lender to you.

2. Build up a good network of friends with other brokers from varying backgrounds - it can be an isolating job at the best of times and sometimes its nice to have a chat/moan about the job with people who really understand the issues

3. Go via a network not a DA firm. I went through a DA firm for 18 months, I got no support, no cover for holidays, the compliance was very poor, I was never paid on time and I got no training on nothing. I'm not saying all DA firms are bad but there are a LOT of advantages of using a network and even now as an experienced adviser I use my network a lot (if anyone wants to ask how my network supports me please do)

4, Never be ashamed or embarassed of your level of experience even as a new recruit. You will always know more than your client and have access to a lot more info than they ever will. Remember that no matter how experienced you are there will always be someone somewhere that knows better. If you don't know, don't bumble your way through it, admit it to the client but promise to get back to them with the answer.

5, When dealing with employers and business associates, TRUST YOUR INSTINCTS - many a time I've given people the benefit of the doubt only to regret it later. Most of us know a bad apple when we meet them, don't be sucked in.

Just to add, you work so hard in this industry that time really flys. If working from home its also very easy to get distracted by non work related things and people. Focus on your business, take regular rests to avoid burn out, and be nice to people, even the ones that bug you. You can't have too many friends when first starting out.

I hope that doesn't sound like preaching from an "I'm better than you" perspective because that truly is not how I think - I just like to see people suceed

MM

homer_j_3

Cute_n_Quirky wrote: »

I am not speaking about myself and looking for work, although you brought me into it, I am speaking generally on the issue of finding placements.

You said tha there weren't any around you following my comments that there are always employed roles.

In my past life in working with the general public and learning from them about their wants and needs what I found was that if someone new started - Doctor, Dentist, Estate Agent, Builder, Hairdresser, etc - the general opinion was that because they were new they were completely up-to-date and knowledgeable about their work - therefore they had no hesitation in approaching them.

I have found that with a professional person they get paid for experience. Take a lawyer for example - you can talk to a new solicitor and they have no cases or experience of arguing in a court of law and will oftern need guidance from more experienced lawyers to ensure their prosecution or defence arguments are water tight.

If someone asks you a question, you may know the answer but not fully appreciate the consequences of what you have said.

To my way of thinking it was always a back-to-front way of looking at things!

I hope you find many clients with your like minded thinking - I won't use someone who has done their jobs for many years because they will not be upto date with their knowledge when someone fresh will know how to help me with the biggest financial commitment of my life? I don't think so..

What works for one client won't necessarily work for another.

Very true, can you adapt to meet each of these clients or will your inxperience mean that you can only work one way which excludes you from helping more difficult clients or those that will question everything?

Cute_'n'_Quirky

Homer - you would do well in life-coaching

MortgageMamma

He's very good at making people think of things from other perspectives I agree

youngmoney_2

Wow what have I started here! Ha ha!

Thanks for all of the comments, even though it did end up pretty much off topic. A lot of good advice in here and I think it's always good to take experience from both sides. At the end of the day if you have a bad experience your ideas will be marred and similarly if you've had a good experience then you will be biased so I guess it's good for me to see both sides of the coin now.

I'm still confident going on what people have told me that this is going to be a good move for me. The company I will be working for gives you ongoing training in a well known estate agent whilst you're doing your CeMap 1 to understand the property market and teach understanding of empathy with the client, then moves you on to a client services role whereby you are booking in people to see mortgage advisors and talking them through the process as you do your CeMap2 and 3. After that there's a really intensive training course for three weeks to bring your level up to the best of the best and only then will you get a place with leads being booked into your diary for you and being safe in the knowledge that you are genuinely working with one of the best companies.

Based on the comments so far regarding lead to conversion rates and the money one would expect from them, I am looking forward to the job. For those who may believe I'm looking at things optimistically I say this; The man who believes something will not happen will be correct, the man who believes something will happen has already increased his chances of success by an infinite amount.

Cute_'n'_Quirky

Have sent a pm with some info for you - youngmoney

HelpWhereIcan

youngmoney wrote: »

...After that there's a really intensive training course for three weeks to bring your level up to the best of the best.

:rotfl:

I genuinely hope it's as simple as that for you. Most people have to get a few years' experince for their knowledge to get "up to the best of the best".

youngmoney_2

I meant the best of the best starts . No, I've worked with people older and wiser than me since I was 17 so I'm fully aware that experience is usually the best way to knowledge, especially in this sort of field .

HelpWhereIcan

youngmoney wrote: »

I meant the best of the best starts . No, I've worked with people older and wiser than me since I was 17 so I'm fully aware that experience is usually the best way to knowledge, especially in this sort of field .

I guessed that was what you meant and was only gently ribbing you.

It does sound like they are going to put some effort into training you. I would try and find out what level of expertise your managers have - ie have they worked for more than the one company and ideally in a broker environment (as opposed to EA) as it really is a different world.

If they have only ever dealt with a panel and only really done straight forward prime business, they are not going to be much help to you when you are competing against an experienced independant and need a bit of help placing the client.

Go into it with your eyes wide open, try and filter out the corporate sales propaganda !!!!!!!! and use the following letter from this week's MI as a salutory tale

http://www.mortgageintroducer.com/ccstory/20803/12/Taken_out_of_the_equation.htm

What that new entrant experienced is by no means representative of what goes on in 99% of firms, but the corporate propaganda of the firm they worked for certainly made them think so.