Underfloor Heating (WarmUp) has just stopped working

melb

hi there please can anyone give me any tips? It's been installed in the bathroom for 5 years and has always been fine. just noticed yesterday that it's not heating up. At first we got the error message of "external failure" so looked that up on the internet and got some instructions of what to do. It cleared the error message but still no heat. We have had some work done in the bathroom last few days but they were removing grout and refurbishing stone tiles on the wall and floor but they didn't remove any grout anywhere near the wires we don't think. when we rang the Warmup helpline they immediately said they must have clipped a wire but we think that unlikely. We have put a call in to an electrician to come and have a look but in the meantime any tops of what to try? We have also pressed the "reset" button on the control panel but no luck. thanks for any advice.

melb

sorry to bump this but wonder if anyone has any opinions - still waiting for electrician to come and have a look

Fire_Fox

Have you reported it to the people who did the grouting? If you may possibly need to claim against them you want to have told them ASAP there may be a problem with their workmanship.

melb

we asked them if they'd knocked the switch which is outside the bathroom as a subtle way of letting them know that there was a problem with it.

jaks101

I used to sell the stuff, the thermostats do break sometimes, to test the wiring find the tail of the underfloor heating and you can wire it directly to a plug and plug it in. If the floor then heats up you can be sure it's the thermostat.

There is always the chance that the wire in the floor has been broken when they were taking out the old grout.

sillygoose

Quite likely they damaged the wire if raking out grout. Or if one is fitted, they may have damaged the floor sensor which is even more fragile.

An electrician with a meter should be able to identify in 5 minutes
either that there is power going to the floor and if the continuity of the heating wire is lost.

After 5 years working it would be inconceivable coincidence that the wire would randomly fail at the same instant the floor is disturbed.

As to the tilers responsibility, were they warned that there was an underfloor heating cable before working on the floor? if not they shouldn't be held responsible. Sometimes the cable is embedded in a screed layer and then tiled over which is a bit safer for this sort of work. But often the cable is just tiled over so any use of metal bladed tools between the tiles is almost certain to damage the cable.

melb

they only actualy removed the the grout at the very edge of the room where it meets the wall and when we removed the bath panel aparently my OH said the wiring was not near there. I'm wondering if it might have shorted out because the reason we had all the refurb work done in the first place is because we have a leak coming through the ceiling directly below where the underfloor heating is where we have a shower over a bath. We got emergency plumber in through insurance and they said it's definitely because the grouting round shower end of bath needs replacing and also the silicone. With the bath panel off we were able to see the wall was damp so went ahead with the work. After paying over £300 for the work doing we used the shower again and the leak was worse than ever - plus the added bonus of the underfloor heating also not working. This leak only happens overnight - and all showering is done only in the morning. Please has anyone any ideas of what this leak might be coming from? it is clear water. Could it be coming from behind the shower unit? (an electric Mira one only 3 years old? and why only at night? We're racking our brains and so are various plumbers. by the way they will have known about UFH because when the bath panel was removed they will have seen matting which goes under there a bit

andyhop

melb wrote: »

they only actualy removed the the grout at the very edge of the room where it meets the wall and when we removed the bath panel aparently my OH said the wiring was not near there. I'm wondering if it might have shorted out because the reason we had all the refurb work done in the first place is because we have a leak coming through the ceiling directly below where the underfloor heating is where we have a shower over a bath. We got emergency plumber in through insurance and they said it's definitely because the grouting round shower end of bath needs replacing and also the silicone. With the bath panel off we were able to see the wall was damp so went ahead with the work. After paying over £300 for the work doing we used the shower again and the leak was worse than ever - plus the added bonus of the underfloor heating also not working. This leak only happens overnight - and all showering is done only in the morning. Please has anyone any ideas of what this leak might be coming from? it is clear water. Could it be coming from behind the shower unit? (an electric Mira one only 3 years old? and why only at night? We're racking our brains and so are various plumbers. by the way they will have known about UFH because when the bath panel was removed they will have seen matting which goes under there a bit

Have the stone tiles been sealed .....porous and will allow water to pass. Grout is also porous too and will also allow water to penetrate. Sounds like the tiles could be spot fixed and not tanked too

Ufh must be covered by screed or adhesive, if you can see the matt under the bath then straight away there's a install fault. The wire must be covered as it will just burn out....no warranty from manufactor due to incorrect installation

sillygoose

As Andy says above +1

Also even if they did just the tile floor edge, the cable from the floor mat (and the even more delicate sensor cable if installed) have to exit from under the tiles into the wall where the control unit is. Usually at the base of the skirting through a hole, below the tile level so out of sight when the tiles are down. Anyone raking grout across this area could damage the cable(s) easily. Water leak won't have damaged the UFH, its a sealed cable system, unless it got into the controller on the wall!

It really just needs testing out electrically.

melb

thanks again - the area they regrouted on the floor is nowhere near the wall where the control panel is so fingers crossed they may not have harmed it. Don't know where the floor sensor is or indeed if we have one because I think there is a choice of floor or air sensor? Not that we were ever asked which one we wanted. the tiles were sealed when first put on and then once again afterwards and have now been sealed again. the grouting has been replaced where the water hits the walls from the shower and this has been separately sealed with a grout sealant. have you any ideas at all where this leak could be coming from? it seems peculiar that it only happens overnight and even when we have used the shower daily sometimes there has been nothing for a couple of weeks and then it starts again. One of the plumbers from the insurance company (on whose advice we had the refurb work done on the tiles/sealant) said that is because it will only come through the ceiling once the joists and the structure of the ceiling are saturated and it has nowhere else to go. We're waiting in for the insurers to send round a third person to have a look. I have been googling like mad this morning for possible answers to night-time leakage but some of the answers have been of a rather more intimate nature!!!!!!!

andyhop

Check the resistance of the matt and stat. The controller would usually through up a fault code if there's a open circuit

It defo sounds like spot fixed tiles if the water is getting behind the grout