EU pension law - any knowledge?

Andy_L

insanojackson wrote: »

Now I am going to be a big looser in the police pensions reforms however without going into the detail of that I am sure I have read somewhere that there is a piece of EU law that states pension schemes cannot be changed when someone is within 10 years of retirement.

Its not law, its a decision the government (employer) has made as a matter of employee relations.

hyubh

insanojackson wrote: »

the lack of industrial rights

However, it is because the police are the police that central government has historically fudged reforming police pensions in the first place - local government and school workers (for example) don't benefit from double accural rates, normal retirement ages in their fifties, or (when the scheme was last changed) an ability to stay in the (more generous) older scheme if you were already in it.

More generally, the effect of more stringent legislation protecting previous pension rights (which I broadly support BTW) has been to quicken the closure of old schemes, at least to new entrants. It's only really in the public sector, where the power of labour (small-'l') is relatively stronger, that there has been the impeteous to devise reforms that, while making things a bit worse for existing employees, substantively preserve the availability of decent pensions to new recruits.

atush

insanojackson wrote: »

Shame nobody can advise really, and shame its just the "your better off than everyone else" line, well all those people who are worse off could have joined the police if they wanted to and put up with the violence, the abuse, the restrictions on your private life, the restrictions on where you can live, who you can be friends with, the lack of industrial rights, the shift work etc etc etc of course all of those were in exchange for a good pension after 30 years service..........


However hang on, after 16 years service thats i been taken away from me. If i retire when i was meant to after 30 years service i will now get approx 58% of what I signed up for 16 years ago. This is a none starter really as i will end up working and extra 5 to 10 years too!

Given the pension is protected in law (sect 2 police pensions act 1986) which the government are ignoring! and that I have based my financial plans (mortgage etc) around my pension as I signed up for I do think its a little unfair that some are being hit so hard whilst others are not being hit at all.

it is more the shame that you an intelligent individual (well we hope anyway) doesn't understand that no one is giving you an 'out; is that there isn't one.

and although we thank you for your service, we are also intelligent enough to know that your pension (even the new one) is better than most anyone else gets, and we also see the abuses of your positions in the current news re: the AM inquiry.

If we can't trust the police, who can we trust?

We do understand your disappointment. REally.

We do not understand your lack of understanding of the basics of economics and the general state of the UK public purse. Watching 48 yr olds under the previous plan retire to France/spain on 2/3 pay in a new home bought with the TFLS can skew the public opinion against the old police retirement scheme.

Uglymug

I also hope there’s a law that states pension schemes cannot be changed when someone is close to retirement.
We could then lock up most of the directors of the FTSE 100 companies, all of whom have changed the rules of their company’s pensions to be less beneficial.
We could also lock up Gordon Brown for his raid on pension funds – he didn’t even have the decency to preserve accrued benefits (the luxury that the Public Sector have with their pension reforms) Gordon Brown retrospectively raided all pensions – it was a bit like introducing a law that said that cash ISAs could not be closed, and then taxing them.
You have a simple choice: If you don’t like your pension reforms – don’t contribute to them, if you don’t like your employment conditions, find another job.
I personally know of people in the Private Sector who’ve lost their entire pension, I think it’s really perverse that some members of the Public Sector are complaining because they have to pay a few pennies more to keep their over generous pensions.

somethingcorporate

Uglymug wrote: »

I personally know of people in the Private Sector who’ve lost their entire pension

Really?

Sounds like you are scaremongering.

Examples please....?

guitarman001

Agree with some of the posts here - the police scheme, even the new one - is pretty good, regardless. I'm REALLY tired about how people think their career is a special case - teachers, police, lorry drivers etc etc.

dunstonh

I personally know of people in the Private Sector who’ve lost their entire pension, I think it’s really perverse that some members of the Public Sector are complaining because they have to pay a few pennies more to keep their over generous pensions.

The number of people who have lost their pension is statistically very small. Maxwell was a good example. Legislation was brought in many years ago to stop that happening and the PPF created. Money purchase schemes cant see their pension lost.

Uglymug

The Pension Protection Fund (PPF) was set up on 6th April 2005, with the following aim “to provide increased protection for members of defined benefit and hybrid schemes by paying compensation should the employer become insolvent and the pension scheme is underfunded.“

Prior to this, when companies went down, they would often take their pension funds with them. Indeed, they would often dip into the pension funds in their final death throes as they desperately attempted to fend off the looming bankruptcy.

I have a work colleague who’s now in his mid fifties; just over 12 years ago he worked for such a company that went down, he contributed to their final salary pension for many years. The lawyers (12 years on) are still fighting the case for his pension – the latest news is he’ll be lucky to get 10p back for every £1.00 he contributed. Next time I talk to him I’m sure he’ll be happy to learn he’s just a small statistic.

dunstonh

Next time I talk to him I’m sure he’ll be happy to learn he’s just a small statistic.

The point is that others should be happy that he is just a small statistic and that the events you talk about are not possible today.

Uglymug

And Public Sector workers should also be happy with the excellent and extremely generous pensions they have and learn to stop whinging because they have to pay a bit more or work a bit longer.