EU pension law - any knowledge?

insanojackson

Now I am going to be a big looser in the police pensions reforms however without going into the detail of that I am sure I have read somewhere that there is a piece of EU law that states pension schemes cannot be changed when someone is within 10 years of retirement.

Can anybody point me in the direction of this legislation??


The reason i ask is the government has given the 10 year notice period from 01/04/2012 but they are still unable to give me and many others the exact details of how the changes will affect us individually. Would it not be reasonable to argue that the 10yr protection period should not commence until we are aware of exactly how the changes will affect us instead of some arbitary date picked by the government?


The basic design of the new scheme was not even revealed until sept 2012 so how they can set a date of 01/04/12 is beyond m?

taking_stock

i dont believe any such legislation exists.

if you're in the police pension scheme, you need to take a deep breath..... then compare it to what everyone else in the country gets.... then breathe a deep sigh of relief that you're being looked after so well. Then go and have a pint to celebrate.

seriously though, i reckognise that the police make a bigger contribution as a % of salary to their pension than other public-sector workers, but then even with the changes they will be getting so much more, and at an earlier age.

JoeCrystal

insanojackson wrote: »

Now I am going to be a big looser in the police pensions reforms

Yeah, I agreed with taking stock. In spite of changes to your police pensions, it is still one of the best in the country, most people would love to have a pension scheme of that kind.

Cheers,
Joe

hyubh

insanojackson wrote: »

The basic design of the new scheme was not even revealed until sept 2012 so how they can set a date of 01/04/12 is beyond m?

I don't know the answer and I hope someone else does. I also hope the usual suspects manage to keep a lid on the meta commentary (we all know the existing police schemes, particularly the older one, are unrealistically generous, even when allowing for the contribution rates...).

Jack_Griffin

You are lucky to be in such a good fund, you seem to understand the crap everyone else has taken with crashing annuity rates.

Thrugelmir

insanojackson wrote: »

Now I am going to be a big looser in the police pensions reforms however without going into the detail of that I am sure I have read somewhere that there is a piece of EU law that states pension schemes cannot be changed when someone is within 10 years of retirement.

NHS followed this principle. In effect accrued benefits are preserved.

Civil service is likely to follow as well.

Retirement age is "normal age" not an individuals selected choice.

Linton

insanojackson wrote: »

Now I am going to be a big looser in the police pensions reforms however without going into the detail of that I am sure I have read somewhere that there is a piece of EU law that states pension schemes cannot be changed when someone is within 10 years of retirement.

Can anybody point me in the direction of this legislation??


The reason i ask is the government has given the 10 year notice period from 01/04/2012 but they are still unable to give me and many others the exact details of how the changes will affect us individually. Would it not be reasonable to argue that the 10yr protection period should not commence until we are aware of exactly how the changes will affect us instead of some arbitary date picked by the government?


The basic design of the new scheme was not even revealed until sept 2012 so how they can set a date of 01/04/12 is beyond m?

Normally changes just affect contributions from a given date. The benefits from past contributions remain unchanged. Is this not the case with the police pension changes?

hyubh

Linton wrote: »

Normally changes just affect contributions from a given date. The benefits from past contributions remain unchanged. Is this not the case with the police pension changes?

I take it you aren't aware of how the 'old' police scheme (for pre-April 2006 joiners
[*]) is structured? There's 30 year's maximum accural, on which you retire on 2/3 your final pay. The 2/3 is reached, however, by each of the final ten years counting double compared to each of the first twenty years.

Hence, the fact currently-accrued benefits will be protected won't prevent serving officers in the 'old' scheme feeling hard done by, given they won't be able to receive the double accural rate in the future they were expecting. Having said that, current proposals for transitional protections under the upcoming career average scheme do try and take account of the issue...

[* Police pensions were last restructured in 2006, however officers already in the 'old', 1987 scheme could stay in it.]

insanojackson

Shame nobody can advise really, and shame its just the "your better off than everyone else" line, well all those people who are worse off could have joined the police if they wanted to and put up with the violence, the abuse, the restrictions on your private life, the restrictions on where you can live, who you can be friends with, the lack of industrial rights, the shift work etc etc etc of course all of those were in exchange for a good pension after 30 years service..........


However hang on, after 16 years service thats i been taken away from me. If i retire when i was meant to after 30 years service i will now get approx 58% of what I signed up for 16 years ago. This is a none starter really as i will end up working and extra 5 to 10 years too!

Given the pension is protected in law (sect 2 police pensions act 1986) which the government are ignoring! and that I have based my financial plans (mortgage etc) around my pension as I signed up for I do think its a little unfair that some are being hit so hard whilst others are not being hit at all.

The_Angry_Jock

insanojackson wrote: »

Shame nobody can advise really, and shame its just the "your better off than everyone else" line, well all those people who are worse off could have joined the police if they wanted to and put up with the violence, the abuse, the restrictions on your private life, the restrictions on where you can live, who you can be friends with, the lack of industrial rights, the shift work etc etc etc of course all of those were in exchange for a good pension after 30 years service..........

Conversely, if it's so terrible you can leave and find a job that fits the criteria you so desire.

bigadaj

That one of the problems with the forum in thAt people get aggressively adversarial rather than reasoned debate.

Kudos for the OP if he's been factoring in the pension to the extent detailed, but I'm not sure many of his colleagues would have such awareness or the pension would have been that big a factor in signing up.

The world changes over the years, and no guarantee ever really works out to be that over decades. The criticism detailed here is an impression from the general populace that the public sector is getting a very easy ride since the credit crunch hit, and the pain has to be shared to a certain extent. With respect to bankers, then I'd have no problem in retrospectively claiming back bonuses that were based on unsustanable trading, but that doesn't seem to be feasible.

One thing for sure is that the financial outlook for most people will be worse the you get they are, so in the OP s position he won't be getting as good a deal as those a few years older, but will be significantly better off than those younger.