What would you offer for this property?

grifferz

This property seems massively over-priced:

http://www.rightmove.co.uk/property-for-sale/property-37408837.html

#1 which is also a 2 bed end terrace in that road sold for £193k in 2012:

http://www.rightmove.co.uk/house-prices/detailMatching.html?prop=14443696&sale=46890437&country=england

I suspect it needed a bit of work inside when it did.

#8 which is a 2 bed mid-terrace sold for £207k in 2011:

http://www.rightmove.co.uk/house-prices/detailMatching.html?prop=19595898&sale=23729499&country=england

I actually rented a house on this street for 5 years and know all the 2 bed properties (whether end terrace or not) have identical layout.

So as far as I can see what it has going for it over #8 for example is:

• End terrace not mid terrace
• More modern and decent standard of finish
• Summer house [STRIKE](not pictured)[/STRIKE] Is now pictured in a RM update

Granted those three worth something, but I don't believe worth £33k of something. Would you agree?

What do you feel it is worth (your opinion)?

Thanks!

lessonlearned

I've read the EA's details. Is the space to the side "yours" or is it shared. Is the space large enough to park a car, if so that is a big plus, even in a cul de sac.

Yes the house is modern inside, but is it to your taste, would you be paying a premium for something you don't particularly like - ifyswim.

You will of course pay extra for an end terraced house compared with a mid terrace and if the side piece of land is exclusive to you then that it is also worth quite a bit, especially if you can drop the kerb and turn it into a private driveway.

Before making an offer I would clarify the issue of the side piece of land and I would check with the council to see whether or not they would grant planning permission to drop the kerb.

I would think that being an end terraced and having off street parking could add at least £10K.

The back garden is a bit tatty but the summer house is a nice touch, especially if it has electricity laid on. It could be a nice "den"or even a workspace. The garden could be improved at relatively little cost,

Why not offer at least 10% lower than the asking price and see how you go. You could always up your offer.

grifferz

Thanks for the reply. After no one else ventured a response today I was thinking it wasn't going to get anything at all! I realise people are hesitant to offer any more advice than "a property is worth what you are prepared to pay for it".. just kind of want to check my reasoning is sound on this one.

lessonlearned wrote: »

I've read the EA's details. Is the space to the side "yours" or is it shared. Is the space large enough to park a car, if so that is a big plus, even in a cul de sac.

No, visible in the right hand side is the neighbour's garage. The access to that will be theirs of course.

Yes the house is modern inside, but is it to your taste, would you be paying a premium for something you don't particularly like - ifyswim.

Sure, I know what you mean: Ideally we would want a house with slightly dated decor like #8:

http://www.rightmove.co.uk/house-prices/detailMatching.html?prop=19595898&sale=23729499&country=england

so that we could do it up exactly how we wanted.

It is nice that the property in question is pretty modern, but of course there are a couple of things we would prefer to change. I mean the second bedroom's flower pattern wallpaper is a bit much for us. Partner is not in love with the lounge's laminate flooring, and so on.

However, I don't see that you can sensibly deduct money off an asking price over a matter of taste as opposed to something fundamentally wrong with a property. Yes, anything that "must" be changed must be budgeted for, but to me that affects how much we can afford to spend, not how much someone should be asking.

You will of course pay extra for an end terraced house compared with a mid terrace and if the side piece of land is exclusive to you then that it is also worth quite a bit, especially if you can drop the kerb and turn it into a private driveway.

In this case you can't; there is no space to the side except for the entrance to the gate. It has road parking in front of the property, and no front garden to speak of.

The back garden is a bit tatty but the summer house is a nice touch, especially if it has electricity laid on. It could be a nice "den"or even a workspace.

We are viewing soon and will find this out.

Why not offer at least 10% lower than the asking price and see how you go. You could always up your offer.

At the moment I am struggling to see how this is worth 33k more than #8. It is basically down to #8's £207k plus whatever we deem the end terrace, modern decor and summer house are worth. Am I wrong to think this way?

Bear in mind the layout will be exactly the same as #8 except that the bathroom has a window in it, and you get access to the back through a gate instead of only through the house.

According to land registry no property in this street has sold for more than £225k (although that was in 2005), and some of these properties are larger 3 bed places. The only recent sales were 2 bed places at £193k and £207k as mentioned.

Thanks again for the advice.

Mozzanov

Well, it seems to have a nicer kitchen than #8. #8's garden is nicer, but smaller (or so it seems). However, it's current state isn't such a big issue (there's plenty of potential and the condition could be worse).

#1 (going by the photos I saw on Zoopla) doesn't have as nice a kitchen.

For the one you're interested in, it looks like money has been invested on the interior. The price is a bit high, but how much would it have cost for the kitchen? What's the larger garden worth to you? Also, which direction does the garden face? (This will dictate how much sun light you're going to get, when it will be in shade, etc, and if you enjoy being in the garden then it can be worth the extra for the right direction. I personally prefer a south facing garden, although it's very nice on the summer mornings in my current east facing one.) The photos don't appear to be a reliable indicator due to the weather on that day.

Not £33k worth, but maybe start off at £217k as a negotiating point?

grifferz

Mozzanov wrote: »

how much would it have cost for the kitchen?

I would be interested to hear people's opinions on this, bearing in mind that the kitchen room from #8 is going to be the same dimensions as the kitchen in this one, just the units have been changed. All these houses were built in 1995.

What's the larger garden worth to you?

We're not bothered about a larger garden, #8's would be adequate. Given the choice we would rather have #8's front garden than be so close to the road as with this one. Though it is a cul-de-sac and only thing directly in front is the parking space for the property, so not too bad.

Also, which direction does the garden face?

North - we rented a property a few doors down from this one on the same side for 5 years.

Not £33k worth, but maybe start off at £217k as a negotiating point?

I think that's going to be a little bit above what I would be willing to pay maximum here. I just can't make the numbers add up vs. #8. Ah well, we'll see.

Thanks!

Mozzanov

grifferz wrote: »

I would be interested to hear people's opinions on this, bearing in mind that the kitchen room from #8 is going to be the same dimensions as the kitchen in this one, just the units have been changed. All these houses were built in 1995.

We're not bothered about a larger garden, #8's would be adequate. Given the choice we would rather have #8's front garden than be so close to the road as with this one. Though it is a cul-de-sac and only thing directly in front is the parking space for the property, so not too bad.

North - we rented a property a few doors down from this one on the same side for 5 years.

I think that's going to be a little bit above what I would be willing to pay maximum here. I just can't make the numbers add up vs. #8. Ah well, we'll see.

Thanks!

The kitchen price would really depend on what's included (appliances, for example). For that one? A guess of £5-8k. it's more than just units - tiling, probably some plastering, electrics, plumbing, appliances, etc. Price for this will also depend upon location (costs for labour). So, that makes it worth a bit more than #8. Shame about the north facing garden, for me that would mean the garden doesn't add extra value.

I still think it's worth a bit more than #8 due to the kitchen and as it's end of terrace, less noise (in theory), but the insulation might not be as good.

Good luck with whatever you decide to do, mate.

grifferz

After viewing, it was a bit frustrating.

When seen up close, we could not agree that the property was in the "exceptional condition" as described on the listing.

Okay so it has a newish kitchen but it's clearly a pretty cheap one, some cabinets not opening quite right. The laminate flooring which you can see is cheap was also quite scuffed, scratched and dented in many places. Boiler probably dates from 1995. Fitted wardrobe doors not working properly. Quite a few bits of woodwork need repainting so you'd probably end up repainting the lot.

Fair enough, wouldn't as a rule put me off, just things to take into consideration. But then EA drops the bombshell.. vendor requires £235k to fund their own move and won't consider less.

Well, quite aside from the matter of #8 two doors down selling for £207k 13 months ago, you have this property 2 minutes walk away:

http://www.rightmove.co.uk/property-for-sale/property-40532654.html

Really if you were spending £235k which would you be spending it on?

There is some disagreement between myself and my partner over whether we would go to £210k or £215k should the vendor adjust their expectations. We haven't got back to EA yet with our thoughts and I'm not sure there is any point in doing so yet. What do people think?

Should we wait it out for a bit and see if vendor realises they are not going to get £235k and drops it a bit, or should we make our offer now even though it might offend them?

And if we should make an offer now, given the huge disparity between what we would be willing to go to and what vendor requires, would there be any point in starting even lower than what our max is and working up to it (assuming they don't just put the phone down on us)? Or should we just put our best and final offer on the table right away and ask them to come back to us later on if they change their minds?

Mozzanov

£210k sounds reasonable, considering all the problems. (Assuming you would get a new kitchen, flooring, etc.)

Is your desire to live in that area very big? Are there no alternative properties? Could it be a long wait and you'd rather move sooner? That could mean the extra £5k is worth it. Obviously, you need to draw the line somewhere though.

In the end, the vendor might go for £210-215k, if they really need to sell (don't take their word for it they need £235k). Perhaps at first you'll need to walk away, but they could come back The other property at £240k seems steep, considering the amount of work required (without doing a proper inspection to see what more is needed). Although it is a semi, is it actually significantly bigger though or is there a third bedroom at the expense of the other bedrooms? (It doesn't seem significantly bigger, IMO.)

I would go for neither, though, as they both have north facing gardens. Let's imagine they were south facing, then probably the two bedroom place. The semi comes across as cramped.

grifferz

Mozzanov wrote: »

Is your desire to live in that area very big? Are there no alternative properties? Could it be a long wait and you'd rather move sooner? That could mean the extra £5k is worth it. Obviously, you need to draw the line somewhere though.

We're not blinded to other locations within ~1mile of the station, but that estate is our favoured location and within that estate, that road is our favoured road, so that is definitely worth something to us, yes.

There's only been two sales on that road in the last three years, so there's that as well. We accept if we lose this then there probably won't be another for years. We're not in a huge rush though.

I think my partner and I have now reached agreement on what it would be worth to us, so the questions stand:

Do we put in any offer now, while it is still so new to the market and we are told the vendor requires £235k?

If so, do we start lower than our max, or do we just make an immediate final offer of our max, given that our max is still way less than £235k?

I was thinking that a low offer now will be immediately rejected and may cause bad feeling, vs. letting the vendor realise it needs to be lowered. But on the other hand if we don't make an offer at all then how will they know we have any interest at all? They may sell to the first person who does make a low offer and leaves it on the table.

I'd really appreciate any advice on those.

yoyoegg

I guess you are paying a premium for the fast trains to Waterloo and the ease of getting to LHR for business flights. If those don't concern you, it seems an awful lot for a 2-bed terrace.

Are you a FTB and proceedable with finance approved? Always worth pointing that out when you make an offer. I'd say an offer 5% less than asking is built into the price, an offer 15% under is likely to be rejected at once on a new instruction, so in between is sensible range.

There's only been two sales on that road in the last three years

If you've been watching for a property to come up in the street, so may others. The house is worth what someone is willing to pay to live there, not by putting a ££ value on the kitchen units.

grifferz

yoyoegg wrote: »

I guess you are paying a premium for the fast trains to Waterloo and the ease of getting to LHR for business flights. If those don't concern you, it seems an awful lot for a 2-bed terrace.

This is the area we need to live in because of work and family ties. That property is cheaper outside of London is not a shock to me. I was born in Birmingham. We could buy a house for cash there at the moment.

Do have a look what ~£220k buys you in TW13 and TW14.