Suspended During Grievance

Uncertain

kelly_borntoshop wrote: »

is that just a bug i am going to have to bear?

Probably I'm afraid.

There is no real answer to this. Even if you were in a strong enough position to force them to agree to a reference that makes you out to be an indispensable saint that can have its own problems.

Many employers will read something too gushing and OTT and immediately assume "settlement, she must have had them over a barrel"!

You mentioned that the job offer you currently have said something like "subject to satisfactory reference, us to decide what is satisfactory". That is precisely so that they can, at their discretion, give a wide berth to anything that smells of being forced.

kelly_borntoshop

So redundancy will look better to employers - however there is always that stigma of a factual reference plus redundancy = cover up. then again there is the economy at the moment...

do you think redundancy is better than resigning for reasons of child care perhaps?

i hate to be a pain and try to wiggle a bit here, its just that i need this to be right.

kelly_borntoshop

I said i would get back to him today. should i just go with what we have in daisys draft? you guys are the experts.

also new job says if i dont get back by close of play he will assume i do not want the offer. i should call him.

Uncertain

In the absence of a reply from Daisy, my view would be yes and yes.

kelly_borntoshop

Re: reference - dates worked.

should i insert 31st January as my termination date or other?

Uncertain

kelly_borntoshop wrote: »

Re: reference - dates worked.

should i insert 31st January as my termination date or other?

31st at this stage as that is what is in the draft CA.

Obviously if that changes prior to signing the reference will need to be changed to match.

zzzLazyDaisy

Either that or just leave the reference saying "[date] to [date]" and let them fill in the blanks. I am easy, either way.

Apart from that I don't have anything to add to what Uncertain has already said.

Dx

kelly_borntoshop

ok. all done. see what come back.

thank again. dont know what i would have done without you guys except make a complete mess of this whole thing.

SuzyZ

From experience you *may* have to be content with a reference stating 'Kelly was employed from xxxx time to xxxx time' which is what I've had in the past from one disgruntled employer who *didn't want me to leave*.

This employer I had run into a few minor scraps with one director who'd wanted me to undertake a new task I wasn't happy with doing nor did it make sense and I was given a warning for refusing to do this and also in the past there had been some silly gossiping where I had apparently with another colleague passed judgment on 2 co-workers having an affair - I had said I didn't feel it was professional especially as I worked with one colleague who constantly showed/brought things her married partner had bought her in the office to us. When I and the other person involved confronted one of four people who'd supposedly complained (they were told 'I didn't say anything about you, eg complain'). anyway that's by the by now.

The most important thing is

• does your warning have any meaning eg will it be applied to your reference?
• CA - what does that say about references, will they do the xxxx time bit or give a more fair and detailed reference?

As you have a disciplinary (IIRC) as well as the CA part then they may well go down the route 'we can be stroppy and tell future employers about the warning etc'. Hopefully both the FM and MD will override the CD on this and give a fair reference both now and in future.

The only reason I say this, is that when I left that job where I'd been for 6 years - the director who didn't want me to leave, well an agency had faxed through a sort of *checklist* form detailing timekeeping, honesty etc and my employer had marked me down for honesty - god only knows why, I was always honest! but she'd marked me down so much the agency were concerned, told me to get this sorted (I got the time xxxx reference agreed with another director) and I also saw an employment solicitor when I was given written warning so I knew my rights, what to do and say etc - this happened a few months before I decided to leave.

Anyway good luck with it all, sounds a nightmare.

Uncertain

Well the only real point of issue is the extra £100 legal fees.

I don't know where they are getting their advice from but I think they are wrong on point 2. As far a I recall there is an appeal tribunal judgement saying that the parties can put in any reason they like. After all if you both agree then, arguably, it becomes true!

Hopefully Daisy will respond but I stick with my view that the reference is the most important bit. You were uneasy with redundancy so it may be best left blank. I personally wouldn't go for "mutual agreement".

If they get a reference request in the meantime they would be pretty stupid to say anything other than what is proposed for the agreement.

You did say there was no clause about you confirming that you don't have any job offers?

I have to repeat, I don't think you are in a strong position argue very much.