Buy, renovate, sell...?

tim123456789

kingpin1 wrote: »

i dont see what you really have to lose im a builder so its easier for me i also have mates that are trades who are happy to help when not at work as long as you price the work as if you had to get someone in and theirs a small profit youl be fine many properties that appear in great condition underneath the paint etc are not at least this way you control it yourself

and if you don't have mates who will help you out when they don't have any other work on, you wont be paying "mates rates" and wont make a profit.

tim

kingpin1

at the end of the day her intention is to buy a house anyway its not like buying two at the same time ref mates thats why i stated to factor in as if shes paying for everything to be done and paid for! i know im capable of most myself except gas and electrics also get in carpenters etc to do tricky jobs such as mitre worktops a lot of problems are hidden behind other peoples handywork at least you will have peace of mind you have done the foundations of the property right

tunnel

RayKay wrote: »

kingstreet, thank you for bringing those two points to my attention. I had heard the first point about mortgage lenders, but then read elsewhere that it wasn't the case. I'll look into that a bit more. What's the banks reasoning behind this? Is it to discourage flipping? (I live in Hong Kong where the govt recently introduced a special stamp duty payable if you sell within two years. Was supposed to slow the market down. It hasn't worked. The HK housing market is still crazy!) Re your second point, that's a new one for me. Again, I'm interested to know the reasoning behind this? And, would it effect a little terrace at the lower end of the market that had just been brought up to scratch after being untouched for 30 years, do you think? Thanks for your thoughts.

I've just purchased a house that was previously owned for less than 6 months(bought and completed within 2 months of previous owner completing),it is possible but restrictive,depends on who your buyer was lending from.

I'd advise getting to know the local estate agents,call in,speak to them,tell them your a cash buyer....believe me..it makes a difference. Once they know your criteria they are more likely to call you on bargain basement properties. Then do your homework,check local house prices,asking prices,sold prices and get a feel for your market.

Incidently,the property i purchased was a doer upper,it will be worth £10-15k more than i paid and renovated it for going on local asking and sold prices. I never lifted a finger to do it up,left it to the tradesmen. I won't be selling though,it's going to be let out.

If your confident enough,then go for it,but again....DO YOUR HOMEWORK

GreatBigBookcase

kingpin1 wrote: »

at the end of the day her intention is to buy a house anyway its not like buying two at the same time

This exactly...and I'm not mortgaging myself up to the hilt to build up a property portfolio using IO mortgages that mean relying on other people to pay all my outgoings. One property, bought in cash. Worst that happens is I have a mortgage free home to move into.

Do you live near Sheffield, kingpin? Maybe I can give you a job!

tunnel - yes, after reading up on it I've discovered that it's not impossible to get a mortgage on a property within 6 months of it being bought, but just fewer lenders do it, like you say. In my position, waiting an extra couple of months to 6 months, if necessary, won't kill me as its not like I'll be paying a mortgage on the place during that time. This isn't a get-rich-quick scheme...I can be patient.

I plan on making estate my new best friends. Also companies who specifically source BMV properties.

Good to read about your renovation project tunnel. What's interesting re the responses on this thread is that, amongst the many naysayers, the people who are saying it's possible (for a small profit if I'm careful and plan everything properly, of course) are all people who either have experience of actually doing this themselves or work in the trade and know people who are doing it...that's a good sign, right?

moomaa

I don't have experience of buying to sell and make a profit but I do have experience of small children and renovating my own home whilst pregnant and with small children around. I was fine doing work whilst pregnant, I could do a days work then a few hours in the evening, even whilst very heavily pregnant and having two pre-schoolers as well (I wanted the house to a certain point before the baby came). However when baby was here that was it for about a year at least.

It is hard work looking after a first baby, don't underestimate the impact of sleepless nights and the physical toll on your body, especially if breastfeeding. You might be lucky, and get off lightly. You might have a contented, sleep loving baby, you might not! Some toddlers will let you get on with jobs like painting, others would scream until you gave them attention.

If you are planning on leaving the baby/toddler with your mum whilst you work on the house then take into account the impact this will have on your relationship with your mum and your baby, especially if you are planning on living with mum rent free.

In your shoes I would go to college and train to do electrics/tiles/plumbing and then market myself to female clients. You can then build a self employed business around the hours you wish to work. However I am also risk averse and wouldn't want to risk my 100k with little chance to build it up again for the next couple of years.

BlueberryMuffin

I have had a go at renovating a property to sell and I have to to say it was much harder work than I ever imagined. I went on several courses and learned how to plaster ceilings, tile floors and do plumbing. I even rewired the hole house myself and had an electrical inspector from the council come and check it all for me. Together with my husband we installed a kitchen, bathroom and cloak room ourselves, layed wood flooring and knocked down several walls. So it can be done and we did manage to make a profit of about 30k after all the fees and costs in a market that was falling.

BUT it took us many, many years to flip that one house. I fell pregnant and had two babies in that time. Most of the time I was utterly exhausted from little sleep and all the DIY. It was physically very tiring work, especially being a woman. It was dirty and dusty and my hands were continually blistered. It was fun for the first 6 months but after that I came to really resent it and didn't want to continue. I didn't have time for a social life at all and I feel like I missed out on the most precious years of my babies lives. I never ever want to renovate a whole house to that extent with my own hands again. Just thinking back at how many hours I spent makes me want to cry. The money we made was nowhere near enough for all the work and tears we both put in. If I could go back I would most certainly not do it again.

tunnel

RayKay wrote: »

Good to read about your renovation project tunnel. What's interesting re the responses on this thread is that, amongst the many naysayers, the people who are saying it's possible (for a small profit if I'm careful and plan everything properly, of course) are all people who either have experience of actually doing this themselves or work in the trade and know people who are doing it...that's a good sign, right?

Don't get me wrong,when i first kicked off buying houses,the tradesmen first looked upon me as a cash-cow. I shopped around for the tradesmen,plenty of quotes for everything,now i have a small group of them i always use. I trust them,they get plenty of work..everyones happy.

You might want to spread your wings a little further afield too,you'd be surprised how much more you get for your money out of Sheff,i know ,i live just south of it.£100k would buy you 2 good 3 bed semis in some surrounding areas. They are out there. Oh and negotiate when buying,i'm still amazed how much a seller will bend over backwards for a cash buyer.

Think you'll find all the naysayers are the ones that would like to do what your doing but don't have the balls/money. Thats my 2 penneth anyway.

DontLetGo

AlexMac wrote: »

And if you do manage to acquire a trade, in a few years time you'll really be in demand (especially from female clients) as a woman electrician or plumber or whatever.

I work in the trade and actually find the opposite of this especially from the older generation, they are not keen or confident in female workers due to their old style views.

Also when talking to female tradespersons they say when they show up at a job with an male apprentice that the client talks more to the app thinking they are in charge especially if they look older for their age.

I know everywhere is diffrent so just to let you know what you might expect.

Also dont waste money on these courses where they will train you in a trade for £4000 etc or if you do go down this route have a good read into them first and make sure the qualification they are giving you at the end is actually a recognised qualification in the trade.

If i had 100k and wanted into the property game i would personaly look into buying to rent, round my way there are half decent 1 bedroom flats for the 30k mark, that rent for around £250 - £300 a month so either 3 of these or see about using the money for a few deposits on some more expensive houses and take it from their.

GreatBigBookcase

moomaa and BlueberryMuffin, thank you both for sharing your experience. You make some really good points which I've taken on board. For the first project I didn't foresee myself doing any of the work myself anyway (for the obvious baby reason ), although I would like to learn a few skills for any future projects.

tunnel, thanks for your twopenneth Excellent point re looking further afield. I was focussing on a small area of Sheffield that I know well just because I'm so out of my comfort zone with all this I thought at least by sticking to an area I know well would mean one less thing to be scared by! That said, as I'm finding out more and talking to more people, I'm realising that's not necessarily the best business strategy and there are certainly better deals to be had elsewhere and I'm already looking further afield.

DontLetGo, I can see how that might be the case with older customers re having a female tradesperson... I'd briefly looked into some of those types of ourses you mention, but just from their websites and a few review sites I decided they must be a bit dodgy. I currently work in education, and have also done a lot of part-time studying over the years, and my view is: if an educational institution isn't transparent about curriculum and fees on their websites and they use hard-sell approaches to get students to sign up, then they're probably best avoided!

Noted re BTL. I'm beginning to think it's the way to go, at least initially as it'll be a more passive investment than a renovation project. So yes, researching and scheming and adapting my plan and current thinking is buy a BTL property in cash when I first get back to give me a bit of an income straight away. Then, look into getting a mortgage on that so I can use that cash to buy something small to renovate 6-12 months down the line. That said, am now picking the brains of numerous BTL mortgage brokers and I don't think it's going to be very easy at all for me to get a BTL mortgage. Not giving up yet though!

lessonlearned

Hi Ray - I've been following your thread with interest. There have been some interesting comments. All good food for thought.

I'm going to be doing something similar, with a similar budget and not a million miles away from you. We'll have to compare notes.

I don't have a baby to factor into the equation, I have a disabled husband in a nursing home and frail elderly parents who I try to "supervise" and keep an eye on.

So I guess it makes us about even in terms of other committments.;)

One things is for sure it might not be easy but it will be fun (at least it's my idea of fun).