Mortgage paid off but where are the deeds?

shirlls

I paid my mortgage off in December last year and have had a letter saying that the land registry have been notified as there are no deeds. Anyone know what this means?

ReadingTim

I believe they're held electronically at the Land Registry, so rather than recieving the paper title deeds from the mortgage company (as you now own the place, rather than them), the LR have been informed so they can update their records.

Should you need to evidence ownership, a print out from the LR's register will suffice, rather than a photocopy of the title deeds - the originals of which can and do get lost!

caffsean

If your property is registered with the land registry they will hold all information on who is the legal owner of the property (although will have kept a photocopy of an original deed if there was one). It's mainly for unregistered land that paper deeds are so important as it would possibly be the only way of proving land ownership. This might help. x

http://www.landregistry.gov.uk/public/faqs/where-are-my-deeds-kept

shirlls

Thanks for the replies.

So, is it advisable for me to get a print out to show that I own the property?

Land_Registry

There is no need to obtain a print out at this moment in time unless you wish to confirm the registered details and be sure that the charge has been removed.

A copy of the electronic record would be obtained by any future purchaser, lender or other interested party as and when they required it. A copy of today's date for example would have little or no value other than confirming the current state of play.

You can view the register online using our Find a property service (£3) if you wish or obtain a paper copy (£6) - our online FAQ explains more.

Caffsean's link has already explained the background to the deeds in such circumstances. The electronic register is the key source of information although it is important to understand that we will not hold copies of every single deed, especially pre-registration deeds and this is explained in more detail in other FAQs

FireWyrm

I'm paranoid. Electronic copies are a wonderful thing to have, but one cough from the sun and you can say goodbye to your 'deeds'. Personally, I'd print out a copy and keep it in a banklocker (or locker at a storage depot), its where I keep the provinence documents I received when I bought this house - along with things like insurances and personal identity documents. Not fool proof, but gives me peace of mind. I'm not sure what information the LR hold exactly, but the Epitome I have shows ownership of everyone back to the beginning.

G_M

FireWyrm wrote: »

I'm paranoid. Electronic copies are a wonderful thing to have, but one cough from the sun and you can say goodbye to your 'deeds'. Personally, I'd print out a copy and keep it in a banklocker (or locker at a storage depot), its where I keep the provinence documents I received when I bought this house - along with things like insurances and personal identity documents. Not fool proof, but gives me peace of mind. I'm not sure what information the LR hold exactly, but the Epitome I have shows ownership of everyone back to the beginning.

I'm afraid that would be pointless. As the LR Rep has explained, all that would show is that on 14th Jan 2013 you owned the property. 6 months from now, no one would accept this as meaningful evidence for anything.

Plus, of course, the £3 download is not even an 'Official Copy'. It is a non legal copy for information purposes only.

Having said that, in the OP'sposition I would download a copy (here). For the sake of £3 he can then confim that his mortgage has been removed from the records. Whether he then keeps the copy Title or not is up to him.

There may well have been other related documents with the Title:
* Planning Permissions
* Previous Conveyances that still have easements or covenants like rights of way etc
* records of previous sales that have little legal relevance but are of historic interest

and you may wish to locate/keep these.

FireWyrm

So, the question goes back to the beginning...where DO you get a legitimate copy or the original documents which would show ownership? If the LR document isnt worth anything, what's the point?

Surely the original documents cant have been destroyed by the mortgage company? Could they?

I'd be onto the mortgage company and asking what the procedure is to recover these, immediately.

G_M

FireWyrm wrote: »

So, the question goes back to the beginning...where DO you get a legitimate copy or the original documents which would show ownership? If the LR document isnt worth anything, what's the point?

If the property is registered (most are these days) then the only way to prove you own it is via the Land Registry.

And the proof takes the form of an 'Official Copy' of the Register. This can be obtained electronically if you have the correct account with the LR (eg solicitors), OR via a paper version.

The £3 download often recommended here is NOT an 'Official Copy'.

The 'original documents' you ask about, do NOT 'show ownership'. Only an 'Official Copy' of the LR register does this. If the 'original documents' (whatever you mean by this) is lost (say in a fire), you can simply request a new 'Oficial Copy' of the Register.

Surely the original documents cant have been destroyed by the mortgage company? Could they?

I'm afraid some mortage companies have in the past destroyed them (on the basis that the Land Registry is these days the source of proof of ownership.)

However, as you pointed out earlier,

the Epitome I have shows ownership of everyone back to the beginning.

this, of course, no longer proves ownership (as it used to pre-Land Registry). However these documents can be fascinating, and of social, historical, emotional value.

It is therefore wise, as the end of your mortgage approaches, to write to the mortgage lender requesting return of all documents. (To be fair, most lenders do return them automatically. Mine did.)

Finally:

I'm paranoid. Electronic copies are a wonderful thing to have, but one cough from the sun and you can say goodbye to your 'deeds'.

Let's be honest. We now live in a world run by computers. 'One cough from the sun' and all bank records would vanish. Tescos inventory/logistics systems would collapse and their stores would be empty. Ships, aircraft would be grounded. Oil/petrol would dry up (in two days?).

There'd be panic buying, a run on banks (which would be closed as they have no fall-back manual processes or records) and queues at petrol stations.

Within another week - riots. The police would call in the army.

Proving ownership of your property would only be possible, by then, wih the help of a gun.

aeb_2

G_M is correct, some mortgage companies do destroy deeds. This is a shame as they are of historical interest. I suggest if you are interested write to the mortgage company now stating that you will want them when your mortgage finishes and you don't want them destroyed. Too late to do much when they are gone in the shredder.

Johnhowell

shirlls wrote: »

I paid my mortgage off in December last year and have had a letter saying that the land registry have been notified as there are no deeds. Anyone know what this means?

Your Mortgage company may never have received the Deeds and other documents in the "pack". Ask the solicitor you used at the time of purchase or re-mortgage. We went through 3-4 solicitors and mortgage compnaies to locate the deed pack.

HMLR only record information "they" require under their remit. Sadly, this can mean that other "lovely" information is lost.

To answer your specific question - it means the Mortgage companies charge against your property will be removed from the Title following the notification to HMLR.

Good luck.
John