Why won't kitchen retailers tell you the price of individual units?

gregch

Well it's not really like buying a car at all. A car has to have a certain set of components, which are what you get in the basic price of the car. Then the 'extras' are priced individually so you can spec the car how you want it.

With a kitchen, there's a myriad of possibilities (especially with the mid-market German firms) of different cabinets you could use to assemble your kitchen. Without an itemised list of which of these have been used and what the individual cost of them is, how can you make an informed choice as to what units to use.

Added to which, what is the big problem with revealing to the customer what you're charging them for each unit? Why only tell the customer the price of a sample of 6 units, rather than provide a breakdown of the quote with each cabinet priced??

Or if you want another analogy - can you imagine going into the supermarket and not being allowed to see the goods or the prices? Instead a staff member asks you what type of food you like, and how much you want to spend, and then assembles a basket of groceries for you - only telling you the total price? Not sure that would work these days, and for good reason.

Anyway, no point in getting into a endless debate about it. I want to deal with a company that'll tell me how much they're charging for each of the bits, and that isn't you! So all the best, but for that reason, I'm out!

CKdesigner

Sorry, did I say I wouldn't give individual unit prices? No. What I said was I didn't see the point. In 20 plus years of designing kitchens I have never been asked for the price of every individual component in the cabinetry part of a kitchen. But if some one wanted that I would willingly provide it - why wouldn't I?

Can't comment what other kitchen specialists would do but I do not have a problem with it.

Also you have mentioned about 2 wildly different Hacker quotes you have had, this is not completely unusual. Unless both companies are given exactly the same plan and specification to work to, the small differences can really mount up quickly. For example with Schueller I could design 2 kitchens one using the cheapest door and budget in mind for say £5,000 and another kitchen using the most expensive door for a design that would look basically the same for £12,500. It just depends on the specification the customer wants.

Sorry my suggestion about the 6 units was so that someone could use a group of 6 various units to get prices from various retailers for price comparison purposes. This would provide a lot more accurate results for comparison than getting several different designers round to price up their different interpretations for your kitchen.

CK

cyclonebri1

There is a very simple reason;

The units themselves are so cheap that the purchaser would have great difficulty in reconciling it into the whole package price.

Look, and I'll get slagged yet again for this, but there are 2 types of fitted kitchen.
Lets miss out the 3rd, the type we'd all like to think we were getting. This is the carpenter made framework, sized individually to fit your own kitchen, and garnished with hand selected and matched finest English hardwoods. Yes they can be had, but if you were interested, you wouldn't be searching a money saving forum:D

So the 2 types?

Cheap rubbish and expensive rubbish, you take the choice and tell me if in terms of practicality and looks, there is any difference.

Go for the best in the range from a budget make rather than the cheapest from a more upmarket supplier.

The secret is that it is all in the fitting, the end result being so much greater than the sum of the units.

I know of MFI installations by myself and others that are still very presentable 25years on, and they were the cheapest of the cheap.

The cabinets are all spit and sawdust, do you wonder why they don't want to tell you the price:A:A:A:A:A;)

gregch

cyclonebri1 wrote: »

There is a very simple reason;

The units themselves are so cheap that the purchaser would have great difficulty in reconciling it into the whole package price.

Look, and I'll get slagged yet again for this, but there are 2 types of fitted kitchen.
Lets miss out the 3rd, the type we'd all like to think we were getting. This is the carpenter made framework, sized individually to fit your own kitchen, and garnished with hand selected and matched finest English hardwoods. Yes they can be had, but if you were interested, you wouldn't be searching a money saving forum:D

So the 2 types?

Cheap rubbish and expensive rubbish, you take the choice and tell me if in terms of practicality and looks, there is any difference.

Go for the best in the range from a budget make rather than the cheapest from a more upmarket supplier.

The secret is that it is all in the fitting, the end result being so much greater than the sum of the units.

I know of MFI installations by myself and others that are still very presentable 25years on, and they were the cheapest of the cheap.

The cabinets are all spit and sawdust, do you wonder why they don't want to tell you the price:A:A:A:A:A;)

I think there's a lot of truth in this!

Poppy9

I have a MFI kitchen that we paid a carpenter to fit and now at 16 years old it's looking a bit dated but only one drawer has broken which OH repaired!

I want to see a completely itemised bill for my new kitchen so I can decide how much I want the little extras that are nice are they nice enough to justify the extra.

I have a problem with giving a kitchen company a budget as I know they will give me the kitchen that is most profitable for them but may not be the best value for me.

I think the idea of paying independently for a kitchen designer is great as you can work with them to get a kitchen that meets your needs (hopefully if they are any good).

Furts

cyclonebri1 wrote: »

There is a very simple reason;

The units themselves are so cheap that the purchaser would have great difficulty in reconciling it into the whole package price.

Look, and I'll get slagged yet again for this, but there are 2 types of fitted kitchen.
Lets miss out the 3rd, the type we'd all like to think we were getting. This is the carpenter made framework, sized individually to fit your own kitchen, and garnished with hand selected and matched finest English hardwoods. Yes they can be had, but if you were interested, you wouldn't be searching a money saving forum:D

So the 2 types?

Cheap rubbish and expensive rubbish, you take the choice and tell me if in terms of practicality and looks, there is any difference.

Go for the best in the range from a budget make rather than the cheapest from a more upmarket supplier.

The secret is that it is all in the fitting, the end result being so much greater than the sum of the units.

I know of MFI installations by myself and others that are still very presentable 25years on, and they were the cheapest of the cheap.

The cabinets are all spit and sawdust, do you wonder why they don't want to tell you the price:A:A:A:A:A;)

Also my thoughts, and put to me by those who know. Plus it is possible to get an individual, hand made kitchen with a laminate or veneered wood carcass with quality doors, trim and ironmongery for a fraction of the price people are led to believe.

Poppy9

We are thinking of putting in a new kitchen in our rental property and a fellow LL has recommended Screwfix. I didn't even know they did kitchens but he said he's used them and found them good value for the houses he rents out.

rustyboy21

Mine is a different industry, but I don't give an itemised quote for what the customer is buying.

Tkae a fire for example. I sell one brand of fire, in which you can choose the trim and fret options. They are all priced seperately. Looking at the prices I buy them for, I can make a margin out of the engine part of the fire, but I sell the trims for the same price I buy them at + £5 and the fret the trade price + £5. They cost so much, I don't have it in me to put my normal 40% margin on.

After I give a price out and the customer has accepted it, then I have to stick to that price. If the whole chimney breast of plaster comes off as I take out their old fireplace and it costs me 5 bags of plaster, 2 more bags of cement and the labour involved, then that is taken out of any margin I have made.

I can see why kitchen co's do it . They may be making single figure % margin on doors/handles, etcbut a bit more on the carcases and white goods.

If they gave the customer a complete price breakdown, the customer could then order certain bits from the company which they make nothing on and others off the internet and expect them to do the work just the same and expect them to rectify the faults iff building work becomes required.

99% of consumers are happy to have an overall price, that fits in with their budget andhas the products that fit their aspirations and lifestyle.

It is only the 1% that don't accept it and find it necessary to come on boards like this and complain about it and say all companies are cowboys.

We are not all out to do you, we do have some morals !

Poppy9

rustyboy21 wrote: »

Mine is a different industry, but I don't give an itemised quote for what the customer is buying.

Tkae a fire for example. I sell one brand of fire, in which you can choose the trim and fret options. They are all priced seperately. Looking at the prices I buy them for, I can make a margin out of the engine part of the fire, but I sell the trims for the same price I buy them at + £5 and the fret the trade price + £5. They cost so much, I don't have it in me to put my normal 40% margin on.

After I give a price out and the customer has accepted it, then I have to stick to that price. !

but with something like a fire you can quite easily compare prices as you have a make and model usually and then you decide who you want to fit it and although price is a factor you also take into account recommendations etc. as most people know it's not worth saving a few quid to have a cowboy fit it.

Another example would be driveways. You can price your paving stones yourself and you can get someone to give you a price to lay the drive or you can get someone to give you an all in price - supply and fit. You can compare the actual components, you can compare the fitting cost. Then you can decide which is the best option.

cddc

My employers (Wickes), have stopped printing price lists for the to order "Style" kitchens, although you can download one off the website if you really want a copy of it.

They have never fully explained why to us why though I can think of three good reasons.

1) We used to pulp 1000's per store when we went in and out of sale 8 times a year...huge cost saving.

2) When out of sale our list prices were (are) stupid, and the list takes no account of the "Giveaway" offer when out of sale.

3). And this is the big one. They were, in general and in most cases flat wrong, and gave a misleading overall idea of what a whole kitchen would cost from us. This is because they took no account of any additional discounts available on a whole kitchen. For instance, a Sale price list just shows the headline discount of 50% off a unit price. Not any addtional discounts that are always on offer. Also list price only on appliances. I have never sold appliances with a kitchen at list price in or out of sale! On average, a customer trying to work out a kitchen cost from our price list would actually be getting the impression that it was costing them up to 30% more than they would, in reality, be paying!

So although you can get a price list from us, it does not reflect what you actually pay for any of the items listed in it!:D Useful eh!

Smoke and Mirror pricing is annoying and common throughout the industry. I am certainly not holding up my employers as shining beacons of clarity,just pointing out that price lists are not always a good guide. They may well tell you what you might pay for one unit if that was all you were ordering, but little more than that.


And Phil99.....that unit price you see on your Howdens quote as an end user....is that the price Howdens is actually charging the trade account holder who will actually be buying the kitchen on the end users behalf? Really? All the time? Trying to hold up Howdens or any of the trade sheds as a paragon of virtue in the pricing stakes is quite frankly :rotfl:. Ooooh look I got an 80% discount! Off what ?

Though pricing really should be clearer throughout the industry, complaining about margins is fairly pointless too. How often to people buy a kitchen? How often do they buy a pint of milk? If you applied the same margin to both, no one would be selling kitchens.