Newsnight: Housing shortage the biggest social justice crisis of our times

ruggedtoast

HAMISH_MCTAVISH wrote: »

Idiots.

We already have 2 millions lots with planning permission.

It's not a shortage of lots with planning permission that is causing the current lowest building levels for 100 years, it's a shortage of mortgages and development funding.

Builders wont build what they cant sell.

Oh what rot Hamish. How much does it cost to get a bunch of Eastern Europeans to build a shonky new build 2 up 2 down? About £30k probably all in.

No people cant get the mortgages to give the builders the 500% clear profit they seem to expect for selling anything, and nor should they. Your paradigm of endless exponential debt to solve the housing crisis would be batty were that not insulting to parsimonious bats.

Builders are quite happy to sit on landbanks with notional values in the billions rather than expose the actual values of their companies by building things that people can actually afford to buy.

If the companies that provided electricity were as hopeless as the companies that are meant to provide buildings we would all be sitting in blackouts 9 hours of the day and they would be nationalised.

PaulF81

To be fair, the builders have to give houses away to the local authority so scum can be mixed in with nice hardworking people in some hope the scum genes can be somehow taken out of their genetic being.
Unfortunately, the experience of may work colleagues unfortunate to buy new build shows otherwise. Noise complaints, social disorder, scratched cars.

ruggedtoast

PaulF81 wrote: »

To be fair, the builders have to give houses away to the local authority so scum can be mixed in with nice hardworking people in some hope the scum genes can be somehow taken out of their genetic being.
Unfortunately, the experience of may work colleagues unfortunate to buy new build shows otherwise. Noise complaints, social disorder, scratched cars.

Mm. Well, I had a friend who rented a flat in one of these new build areas in Bedford and the crime from some of the social housing people was terrible. They quickly identified the people who had jobs as easy targets for daytime burglary too.

They left as soon as their 6 month AST had expired, the people who'd bought there werent so lucky.

I wouldnt say all social housing tenants are like that but new builds by default get all the scummers who have been evicted from everywhere else.

ukcarper

Does it have to be like that I was bought up in a council house and at that time they were not bad places to live and the majority of people living on them worked hard and respected thier homes and other residents.

ukcarper

PaulF81 wrote: »

We don't need council houses. We need new build plots without huge fees to help pay for Chantelle and her 5 brats affordable housing. No planning density requirement, just a way for decent people to build decent family homes affordably.

I think we do but them I'm more concerned with providing good homes for low paid workers than mansions for the middle class.

PaulF81

And what will motivate the middle class to pay higher taxes to fund the lower classes cushy lifestyles in free/cheap housing?

We need to start looking after those that pay the largest haul in tax that makes this socialist superstate possible first.

We shouldn't be forcing social misfits either on people who do a decent hard days work and pay a fortune in tax before finding the money for mortgages and the money to live. First offence or police complaint, you are out, back to the sink estate. Preferably in mid Wales or hull.

ukcarper

PaulF81 wrote: »

And what will motivate the middle class to pay higher taxes to fund the lower classes cushy lifestyles in free/cheap housing?

We need to start looking after those that pay the largest haul in tax that makes this socialist superstate possible first.

We shouldn't be forcing social misfits either on people who do a decent hard days work and pay a fortune in tax before finding the money for mortgages and the money to live. First offence or police complaint, you are out, back to the sink estate. Preferably in mid Wales or hull.

So you think anybody earning a low wage is a social misfit I think that says it all.

coastline

PaulF81 wrote: »

And what will motivate the middle class to pay higher taxes to fund the lower classes cushy lifestyles in free/cheap housing?

We need to start looking after those that pay the largest haul in tax that makes this socialist superstate possible first.

We shouldn't be forcing social misfits either on people who do a decent hard days work and pay a fortune in tax before finding the money for mortgages and the money to live. First offence or police complaint, you are out, back to the sink estate. Preferably in mid Wales or hull.

Pay in the top sector has risen at an alarming rate and to most reasonable people it isn't justified...
There's millions of people who could finance 100k-150k if they had the chance to buy...nobodys asking for handouts..

grizzly1911

PaulF81 wrote: »

Top article in the in the telegraph

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/earth/hands-off-our-land/9792040/Planning-threat-to-grandparents.html

That guy is a twonk.

He was on Newsnight spouting similar vitriol a month or so back.

Lovely theory light on reality.

the_flying_pig

coastline wrote: »

...

i think that's a very important chart.

the private sector isn't particularly doing all that much worse at building houses than it ever did in the past.

sure, it's in a bit of a trough right now because so many of the builders are basically sitting & waiting for higher prices... but privaate sector building levels aren't catastrophically low. they're not at all dissimilar to the 80s bust.

the issue is that the end to local authority building, the sector that in the 50s through 80s used to build about half of all housing, was a massive game-changer. for housebuilding to remain at the same levels [if that was indeed what we wanted] private sector output had to double - we needed a private sector building gamechanger to match the local authority gamechanger. there has been no such game-changer.