Pure Gym cancellation - thoughts?

matty_art

Hello,

I come seeking some advice and also a word of warning.

I have a Pure Gym membership for which £18 is taken in advance in each month by DD. The DD comes out on the same date of the month on which I joined.

I am moving out of the area where Pure Gym is located so wanted to end my membership from the 21st December (when the next payment is due). The only way to do this is to cancel the Direct Debit. I did this last week, thinking that it would only have effect from the 21st, as I'd paid up to then anyway.

However, I went the other day and found that I am locked out of the gym (it's passcode entry) and my membership has been ceased. I actually thought that cancelling a DD was like cancelling a Standing Order and that Pure Gym would only find out when the next DD was run, so this is my mistake, but I'm not sure they should expect customers to know the detailed intricacies of the DD system.

The terms and conditions (tucked away on the Website) do say:

Your membership will be cancelled immediately if you cancel your Direct Debit Mandate.

As I said, I didn't realise that Pure Gym would be notified immediately and made the reasonable presumption that they would continue to provide the service which I had paid for over the payment to which the payment relates.

They also refuse to give any refunds, stating:

Your second Direct Debit for monthly membership fees only will be collected one month after you joined, unless you joined prior to your gym opening in which case they will be collected one month after the gym opened. Subsequent Direct Debits for monthly membership fees will be collected monthly thereafter. Each payment made is not refundable under any circumstances.

My question is whether this is actually legal under contract law? I know the terms and conditions were in place when I signed up but I question the clarity of them, and they are basically now failing to provide the service for which I paid consideration at the beginning of the month. There is obviously no logical reason for me to cease it early and donate them money out of the kindness of my heart; the issue is that I misunderstood the DD mandate set-up. Also there is no loss to them if they continued to allow me access.

One final interesting point - they stated to me:

We can advise that if you are wishing to continue with your membership we are able to reinstate your Direct Debit however, if you are not wishing to make your next monthly installment on the 22nd December 2012 you will be required to stop the mandate at your bank atleast 3-4 working days before this date.

From this, it seems that every single cancellation will result in you ending the membership before the full month's service for the previous month's pay has been provided to the customer.

So in summary, firstly word of warning if you're ceasing membership with Pure Gym - make sure to time it to perfection, and secondly, I'd be interested to read any more knowledgeable thoughts on this.

I would have considered rejoining them when I move back to the area (which I'm planning to do at some point) as the equipment etc is very good, but following this and the pretty poor customer service response I've had, I'd be rather reluctant to do so.

System

Seems a bit dodgy.

However it's only £18 a month and it sounds like your membership was cancelled last week. Say it was the 10th of December that's only 11 days your missing out on. That's about £6 so i would suggest its not worth the hassle to take it any further.

unholyangel

The clause stating no refunds under any circumstances will likely be an "unfair" term and possibly even as far as an illegal term (much in the same way that shops cannot have a sign that says "no refunds").

Did you sign up a minimum term contract with them? Thats the only reason I can think of that they would have a valid reason to suspend your access to the gym for cancellation of future payments.

Unless perhaps youre not paying a full month in advance?

matty_art

Yeah, I know it's probably not worth worrying too much about given the price. I was just frustrated on Sunday having turned up to use the gym, taken the time to get there and park etc. I am more annoyed at not being able to access a gym at all this month (which I need to do for physio exercises) than the monetary value of it.

There is no minimum contract - they state that clearly in their email to me. Here's a quote:

We can confirm that as we are a no contract gym we give our member's the option to cancel the membership at any time. The only way to do this is by contacting your bank to stop the Direct Debit therefore, your membership is cancelled with immediate effect and no further payments are attempted. Also as your PIN is directly linked to your Direct Debit, this determines if the PIN is active or inactive depending on the status of the Direct Debit.

Also my second membership payment left my account exactly 1 month to the day after joining, and so on. It states that in their terms as well. So although they never specifically mention "you pay 1 month in advance", in essence, that's how it works.

What legislation covers unfair terms, out of interest?

Edit 2: also, is it worth reporting this to someone like local fair trading, not to recover my own money, but seeing as they appear to do this to every customer?

somethingcorporate

The no terms of the "no refunds" issue only applies if you genuinely should have a refund.

Given those terms (that you agreed to) are fairly clear I am not sure you are actually due one.

unholyangel

somethingcorporate wrote: »

The no terms of the "no refunds" issue only applies if you genuinely should have a refund.

Given those terms (that you agreed to) are fairly clear I am not sure you are actually due one.

Retailers cant have a "no refund" sign. Whether you're due a refund or not. Even "no refunds unless faulty" isnt allowed now as there are other circumstances where a consumer may be entitled to a refund (other than it being faulty). They can't even use a "your statutory rights are unaffected" disclaimer as its considered legal jargon.

And if they've made a mistake on something so obvious......chances are the rest of their T&C's are the same.


And i'm sorry but people really need to get out of this attitude of "its in the T&C's, you agreed to them and thats that". Just because something is in the T&C's does not mean it is legal or fair.

End of the day OP has paid for a months use and has not received that months use.

somethingcorporate

If a term in a contract is unfair it would be ignored by a court but it would have no impact on the rest of the contract. You can read into the rest of your contract what you like but a court would not.

I agree to the not allowing a blanket "no refunds" but the immediate termination of membership upon cancelling the DD is spelled out clearly and I do not see how or why it is unfair.

I am not sure why you are getting a bit upperty about what I said. I disagree that the terms are unfair and hence my advice is in line with my opinion. I am well aware of the options if the terms are unfair but do not think this is the case here or advocating that all terms in a contract are fair and legal.

matty_art

I suppose the tricky thing is how you actually go about cancelling and not losing out at all. You have to do so by cancelling your DD at your bank, and apparently this can take several working days to work properly. A really strange system which seems to put the customer always at a disadvantage.

Just a question - did you folks know how the DD works then and wouldn't have made my mistake? I'll learn for next time, that's for sure.

somethingcorporate

A DD should be cancelled immediately in theory but banks often take 1-3 working days to action it.

If it does go out anyway I would have thought you should be able to have it returned under the DD Guarantee.

unholyangel

somethingcorporate wrote: »

If a term in a contract is unfair it would be ignored by a court but it would have no impact on the rest of the contract. You can read into the rest of your contract what you like but a court would not.

I agree to the not allowing a blanket "no refunds" but the immediate termination of membership upon cancelling the DD is spelled out clearly and I do not see how or why it is unfair.

I am not sure why you are getting a bit upperty about what I said. I disagree that the terms are unfair and hence my advice is in line with my opinion. I am well aware of the options if the terms are unfair but do not think this is the case here or advocating that all terms in a contract are fair and legal.

I didnt say a court would ignore the rest. I simply said if they'd failed on something so simple and straight forward, chances are they made more mistakes.

As for what i'm getting a bit upperty about (i assume thats the same as pants in a twist) i'm not. I'm simply exasperated that people take things at face value - especially here on a consumer rights board.

If a shop tells a customer "you'll need to go to the manufacturer, its after 30 days and theres nothing we can do", would you tell them to just accept that as they'd agreed to those terms by entering into the contract?


Think about it this way. You pay your milkman up front on a month to month basis. Halfway through the month, you cancel the service for the next again month. The next day, no milk is delivered and when you contact the milkman, he says he's not going to finish the month you paid him for or refund any of your money. Or Virgin/BT cancelling your service immediately and still charge you the 30 days notice. Do you honestly think that is fair? Binding the consumer to pay but not binding the supplier to supply? Again it is covered by unfair contract terms.

If OP had signed up for a minimum term contract (in which the "monthly" rate is often lower than those on a month to month contract) then I would see the fairness in withholding the refund/services. Or if the payment wasnt totally 100% in advance. But from what the OP has told us......imo they have no valid reason to withhold payment AND services.
.

System

matty_art wrote: »

I suppose the tricky thing is how you actually go about cancelling and not losing out at all. You have to do so by cancelling your DD at your bank, and apparently this can take several working days to work properly. A really strange system which seems to put the customer always at a disadvantage.

Just a question - did you folks know how the DD works then and wouldn't have made my mistake? I'll learn for next time, that's for sure.

Personally I would say its to he customers advantage this policy. Seems the easiest possible way to cancel a gym membership. A lot of gyms force you to serve a notice period.