Unauthorised paypal payment for ebay item - help needed

Princess_x

I bid on a phone a while ago and I didn't end up winning so thought nothing of it. Since then I have already bought another phone. Today I must have received a second chance offer and my sister (without asking for my permission) accepted it and paid. Obviously when I found out I got annoyed and messaged the buyer politely asking them to cancel and refund the money explaining what had happened. I received a reply a few hours later from them along the lines of them being messed about and as the listing stated no refunds they didn't have to refund me. (Listing didn't state this, it only states no returns which is obviously not the same thing). Seller then went on to say that she had already transferred the money and ebay have already taken the cut. She then immediately went on to say she would still send out the phone on Monday. At this point I became even more annoyed. I replied back stating that ebay would refund the final value fee if she refunds me and the money not being in her paypal account is not a big deal. I did also tell her as she had still not send out the item I still have a right of asking for a refund and that if she ends up posting it out, I will just end up returning it. I'm currently waiting on a reply.

I do understand her point as a seller but I'm not one of those buyers that likes to cancel transactions alot. I've probably only cancelled around 3 transactions during the last year including this one, all genuine reasons, not just a change of mind.

What I want help with is, if I opened a case, would I have a chance or would ebay side with the seller in this case? Also if she's still being difficult, would an unauthorised payment case on PayPal help? As obviously my sister using my account without my permission is not the same as a total stranger committing fraud.

Any help would be much appreciated.

soolin

Your argument should be with your sister, not the seller and why is someone else able to use your account?

Also you do appear to have pulled out of more transactions in one year than most people do throughout their entire buying career as you say

" I've probably only cancelled around 3 transactions during the last year including this one, all genuine reasons, not just a change of mind."

If the seller is a business then you can return the phone, but obviously at your own cost and using tracking of course. If it was a private seller you have no automatic right to a refund

I think you are on very dodgy ground even contemplating a fraudulent use of account claim to get a refund, and frankly I am shocked to see that suggested here on MSE. If your sister is crooked or a thief then call the police and turn her in- but surely it is more simple to just keep your accounts secure.

Princess_x

But arguing with my sister is not going to get my money back. (I have already had a go at her)

The only reason why my sister has my password is because she doesn't have an ebay account of her own as she's not old enough and she recently had to have an emergency buy that was not available in any pharmacies near us so I let her have my password for any other times she had to buy stuff in an emergency. She was with me at the time when I bid on the phone originally and must have assumed I still wanted it when she saw the second chance offer whilst on ebay.

soolin

Princess_x wrote: »

But arguing with my sister is not going to get my money back. (I have already had a go at her)

The only reason why my sister has my password is because she doesn't have an ebay account of her own as she's not old enough and she recently had to have an emergency buy that was not available in any pharmacies near us so I let her have my password for any other times she had to buy stuff in an emergency. She was with me at the time when I bid on the phone originally and must have assumed I still wanted it when she saw the second chance offer whilst on ebay.

By your own argument then then was not a fraudulent transaction, so if you don't want to get your sister into trouble then drop that idea straight away.

I am also at a loss to imagine what sort of 'emergency' could possibly necessitate urgent use of eBay especially for a pharmacy item..it really sounds like she needs much better supervision.

Change your account passwords for eBay and PayPal immediately, do not allow them to be used by any other person. If you do allow other people to use your accounts then be prepared to payup if they buy something, you allowed them to buy so you are responsible.

However, as per my earlier response if this is a business then you can return the phone using tracked postage. If I was the seller though I would be reporting you for malicious buying under the new 'report a buyer ' facility

Princess_x

soolin wrote: »

Also you do appear to have pulled out of more transactions in one year than most people do throughout their entire buying career as you say

" I've probably only cancelled around 3 transactions during the last year including this one, all genuine reasons, not just a change of mind."

Most people? I don't see any statistics for that. MSE doesn't make up nearly half of ebay users. A lot of people tend to cancel after they've received the item. By then, the seller is already out of pocket from postage. Wouldn't it be best to cancel a transaction for a genuine reason before the seller has posted out rather than return for a refund due to change of mind? The reasons I cancelled in the past were due to listing errors stating one thing in the listing and later on towards the end something being added onto the listing that wasn't there before. As I said genuine reasons.

If the seller is a business then you can return the phone, but obviously at your own cost and using tracking of course. If it was a private seller you have no automatic right to a refund

Seller is a private seller. Surely if she hasn't sent it out I can still ask for a refund?

I think you are on very dodgy ground even contemplating a fraudulent use of account claim to get a refund, and frankly I am shocked to see that suggested here on MSE. If your sister is crooked or a thief then call the police and turn her in- but surely it is more simple to just keep your accounts secure.

I've already acknowledged that my sister using my account without my permission is not the same as fraud, I was asking whether I'd have any grounds with an unauthorised payment claim. Unauthorised is not the same as fraudulent, well that's what the PayPal representative explained to me anyway. :S

I am also at a loss to imagine what sort of 'emergency' could possibly necessitate urgent use of eBay especially for a pharmacy item..it really sounds like she needs much better supervision.

My sister isn't exactly in good health so you can't find the medicines she needs in pharmacies so she uses ebay. She's 16 so she knows what she's doing but as she's not 18 yet she doesn't have any account.

Change your account passwords for eBay and PayPal immediately, do not allow them to be used by any other person. If you do allow other people to use your accounts then be prepared to payup if they buy something, you allowed them to buy so you are responsible.

I do admit I am at fault. As previously stated I understand where the seller is coming from. I have a business aswell and also sell quite a few things privately and have had the same thing happen to me, but a seller should be prepared for different situations. Obviously not everyone is genuine, but looking at past feedback helps.

However, as per my earlier response if this is a business then you can return the phone using tracked postage. If I was the seller though I would be reporting you for malicious buying under the new 'report a buyer ' facility

I don't see how this is malicious buying but okay.

freddysmith

You could just re-sell the phone on Ebay. It was not the sellers fault and you can use this case as a learning experience.

Princess_x

Thanks. After discussing with my sister, we decided to keep it and just gift it to someone when we're abroad next year. Would have preferred to get a bargain closer to the time, but this will have to do especially after ebay fees and postage it probably wouldn't make any difference if I was to sell it on and I do realise the seller wasn't at fault so wouldn't be fair to her.

Thanks for any help.

freddysmith

Hopefully it was not a lot of money. I can only guess the seller is also annoyed as much as you are.
If it was me I would have cancelled the transaction and re-listed, but you will never find everyone with the same mindset as yourself.
They still have Sunday to get through and may have a re-think.

techspec

I totally agree with Soolin - i have never cancelled a sale on Ebay. I would rather just sell it on.

As you say - you could have returned it - but if the seller did not have the money in their account - they could not refund until they did.

Alls well if your keeping it though - but i would be a millionaire if i got a quid every time an Ebayer said "sorry, my sister bid on this".

Oh, and the headline is misleading - your sister was AUTHORISED to use your account.

soolin

freddysmith wrote: »

Hopefully it was not a lot of money. I can only guess the seller is also annoyed as much as you are.
If it was me I would have cancelled the transaction and re-listed, but you will never find everyone with the same mindset as yourself.
They still have Sunday to get through and may have a re-think.

This was not an auction though this was a second chance offer sent ONLY to the OP. OP had to open the offer, see what it was ad then agree and pay (or rather her authorised agent did).

That for me is the distiction, this was not an 'oops i bought something' this was a full acceptance of an offer made by the seller in good faith.

I am still rather worried though at the bit buried in the story about a 16 year old requiring an urgent pharmaceutical item and being given access to an account when they don't seem able to understand how it works.

emmbrook

Princess_x wrote: »

Most people? I don't see any statistics for that. MSE doesn't make up nearly half of ebay users. A lot of people tend to cancel after they've received the item.

*snip*

I don't see how this is malicious buying but okay.

I can't speak for everyone but I first started using eBay in 1999. Since then I've cancelled precisely zero bids. The only time I've had an issue is with one INR and one fake box set. So once every seven years so far....