Rejecting a second hand car

bryan8237

hi, collected a used car on saturday 03/11/2012.

taxed it for 12 months, didnt drive it all until monday morning when i went to work at 10am, at thetop of my road as i turned right, i heard a loud bang and stoppped the car.

i got it back home the following day. and jacked up the rear wheels,

and found the fault.

I emailed the dealer and then rang the dealer and he asked if i could get a price to fix the car.

it would cost at least 180 in parts and 140 in labour.

the dealer said he would refund the money i paid for the car, but not until i had the v5 in my possession.

it will take 4-6 weeks according to the dvla to return the v5.

My question is, should he give me a refund even though i dont yet have the v5?

i do have the new keeper slip from the v5

neilmcl

The new keeper slip is no good to the dealer now as the car is in the process of transferring under your name. There is no reason why the dealer couldn't take the car back and give you a refund apart from being a bit of a risk for him to do so without the V5.

Although it can take 4-6 weeks, from experience it's usually nearer 4 or less.

You could explain, politely, that he's responsible for all costs so if you're forced to hire a car, for example because you're having to wait for a refund, then he'd have to pay.

bryan8237

hi there, I suppose I dont want to antagonise them as I want to make sure that I get a refund.

but I dont see why they wont give me a refund without the v5 because when i bough the car all that i got was the new keeper supplement.

i only bought it last saturday and havent driven it since monday morning, i am going to call trading standards on monday and get some advice.

I dont mind waiting for the refund, I just dont want them to say that its been too long now (if the v5 takes 4 weeks to come back ) and I end with no refund and a car that needs the brake sorting out at a cost of at least £300.

I even said that if they pay for the brakes to be fixed then I will accept the car sold as seen with no warranty, but they wont. they just want to give me a refund.

Fire_Fox

Write to them and formally report the problem and say you are rejecting the car, let them put into writing what they are offering to do. You need a paper trail.

arcon5

I even said that if they pay for the brakes to be fixed then I will accept the car sold as seen with no warranty, but they wont. they just want to give me a refund.

Very odd this!


Have them confirm it in writing (email is fine).

bryan8237

arcon5 wrote: »

Very odd this!


Have them confirm it in writing (email is fine).

hi what do you mean by odd this, have you ever taken anyone to court and won.

its sometimes easier to walk away without the cost of doing to court, how many companies walk away laughing.


be honest when did you last take somebody through the small claims court

unholyangel

bryan8237 wrote: »

hi what do you mean by odd this, have you ever taken anyone to court and won.

its sometimes easier to walk away without the cost of doing to court, how many companies walk away laughing.


be honest when did you last take somebody through the small claims court

I think he means its odd that the dealer wants to refund instead of repairing. Usually its the other way around and you have to fight tooth and nail to get your refund

As for the dealer, as others have said...get something in writing. You could even state to them that you agree to the refund in 4-6 weeks when you produce the V5 providing they give you something in writing stating that they are promising you a full refund.

Alternatively, you could also ask for a partial refund now - with the rest to follow when you provide the V5.....and have an agreement printed up (for both to sign) stating you have received xxx on x date and a further x amount will be provided when you supply the V5.

As for small claims......it costs £25 to file a claim online with MCOL. Further fee's may be applicable - such as hearing fee's which vary depending on the amount of your claim but as little as £30.

A lot of the time yes, its not worth the time/effort to take retailers to court. But small claims is really a simple process and the hearings themselves are usually so straightforward that no legal representation is required (and afaik its for this reason that usually you cannot claim solicitors fees in with your costs).

IMO a request for the V5 before refund is reasonable. IMO your request for such an offer to be put in writing as a show of good faith is reasonable and I cannot think of a single reasonable excuse why the dealer would hesitate in putting the offer in writing unless he's sure or suspects he will not actually go through with it.

If they refuse to put it in writing, you could then think about a LBA but lets not get ahead of ourselves. Try get the offer from them in writing and if things dont go as they should, you can always update the thread so we can give our opinions then.

arcon5

bryan8237 wrote: »

hi what do you mean by odd this, have you ever taken anyone to court and won.

its sometimes easier to walk away without the cost of doing to court, how many companies walk away laughing.

My points been clarified correctly above.. thanks unholy.
Dealers are not well known for handing cash back to customers so its odd they aren't snapping your fingers off and doing the repair.

be honest when did you last take somebody through the small claims court

Not sure what the relevance to this is... But about 13 months ago actually.. An ex LL

bryan8237

hi unholyangel, he has put the offer of a refund in an email, but i guess i dont believe that he will go through with his promise. like you say why not just give me the cost of repairing the rear brakes.


There are a couple of other things wrong with the car, including two that should have failed the mot. I am unsure if it would be wasted money to take it for a new mot and get an unbiased opinion of the cars condition.

I dont really want to get into legal action because about 4 years ago we bought a car from a main dealer, and to be honest trying to get them to fix a problem was a real pain, even after involving trading standards, thats why I would settle for the brakes being fixed. They only fixed the problem because I said I would get it repaired elsewhere and send them the bill. This was after the dealer had attempted a repair about 4 times. you can image how stress full that was.

I thought of involving consumer direct and asking them to contact the dealer to see if he will confirm to them that they will give me a refund when they v5 arrives.

One last thing, I bought the car with a warranty that covered all major mechanical components, engine, gearbox, clutch, drive train.

They have told me via email that they have now cancelled the warranty. This was on thursday of last week. This is a warranty that they pay for, as its insurance backed.

so i guess that they are in breach of contract because I bought a car from them that included a warranty ( that was written on the invoice) but they have now cancelled that warranty. I guess to save money, perhaps that gives me grounds for an immediate refund.

what do you think

unholyangel

bryan8237 wrote: »

hi unholyangel, he has put the offer of a refund in an email, but i guess i dont believe that he will go through with his promise. like you say why not just give me the cost of repairing the rear brakes.


There are a couple of other things wrong with the car, including two that should have failed the mot. I am unsure if it would be wasted money to take it for a new mot and get an unbiased opinion of the cars condition.

I dont really want to get into legal action because about 4 years ago we bought a car from a main dealer, and to be honest trying to get them to fix a problem was a real pain, even after involving trading standards, thats why I would settle for the brakes being fixed. They only fixed the problem because I said I would get it repaired elsewhere and send them the bill. This was after the dealer had attempted a repair about 4 times. you can image how stress full that was.

I thought of involving consumer direct and asking them to contact the dealer to see if he will confirm to them that they will give me a refund when they v5 arrives.

One last thing, I bought the car with a warranty that covered all major mechanical components, engine, gearbox, clutch, drive train.

They have told me via email that they have now cancelled the warranty. This was on thursday of last week. This is a warranty that they pay for, as its insurance backed.

so i guess that they are in breach of contract because I bought a car from them that included a warranty ( that was written on the invoice) but they have now cancelled that warranty. I guess to save money, perhaps that gives me grounds for an immediate refund.

what do you think

You would only have grounds to cancel if you were keeping the car, not to mention that it is more or less irrelevant who supplies the warranty as long as the terms of the warranty are fulfilled as agreed. I say its irrelevant because its the dealer you have the contract with, it is likely the dealer that has the contract with the insurers. Not to mention that even if that happened, it doesnt necessarily entitle you to an immediate refund.

If the email is clearly from their business address, I'd say its proof enough (should things ever get near a court). I understand why you're reluctant after the last car. Having problems can make you wary. Are they in possession of the car?

Did you suggest they give you a refund, minus what it will cost them for a new log book should you fail to produce yours (£25 btw) with the £25 to be refunded when you produce the logbook?

bryan8237

hi, unholyangel, thanks for your time and advice.

the car is on my drive, the handbrake is totally u/s, will cost at least 300 to put right.

i offered to accept £250 less than i paid them for the car, and would wait until i sent them the v5 for the balance to be returned to me but they havent responded to me.

obviously whilst in my care the car is insured by me ( at a cost of £60 per month) and taxed by me and covered by recovery by me. i havent driven it since tuesday of last week.

re the warranty, itwas added onto the cost of the car, and in the warranty booklet it states that the warranty is between the policyholder (my details are shown as the policy holder) and warranties direct who provide the warranty.

it seems to me that until i receive a refund the warranty should still be in place. the dealer has cancelled the warranty to save money.

my worry is that i have to get the car back to the dealer, if the engine fails on that journey a replacement engine will cost well over £1000 plus fitting. and if the garage wont pay £300 to fix the brakes i cant see them paying for a new engine or gearbox.

One very very last point, with my job i work from home and travel around the country doing approx 18 to 20,000 miles a year, next week i have to go to the west country for 3 days and the week after i have to go to kent for 3 days. a total of around 800 - 1000miles.

I dont want to add any miles to the car, and i wont be doing but

do you think it fair for me to hire a car and charge the seller for these business trips.

just wondering if that would make him change his mind about making me wait for a refund. i will probably have to lend my partners car, which means i will have to pay to be put on her insurance so that i can drive it on fully comprehensive.

Re the other problem car that i bought, it was only resolved because i threatened to get the work done and then send them the bill. we then came to a settlement.

however, when i bought the car, they told me it would come with 2 keys, it was a new shape passat, the keys are over 250 including programming by a main dealer.
the invoice for the car mentioned it being supplied with 2 keys.

trading standards called the dealer and the dealer told them that they never supply 2 keys with a car, and it was an error on the invoice.

i never received the other key, thats why i would rather just get the brakes fixed on this one, i wonder how many other people give up and dont bother pursuing dealers.