Parking charge notice, what to do??

mick1812

Help advice needed!!
We have just received a "parking charge notice" from a company calling themselves "Civil enforcement ltd"
They state we overstayed the 4 hour free parking at a local shopping centre (as per the signage), to which they say they have photographic proof of this, and are demanding we pay £150 within the next 28 days or a reduced rate of £75 if we pay within the next 14 days, failure to do so will result in this pcn being forwarded to a debt recovery agency.
We have since been back to shopping centre to investigate and to our surprise the signage states "breach of the parking terms and condtions will result in a charge of £100 or a reduced charge of £60 if paid within 14 days of issue. We have ourselves photographic proof of this signage!!
Wether or not we overstayed our welcome i feel is not the issue here. What has riled myself is that the company has demanded this over inflated payment of 50% more than what is stated on the signage.
Has this company any legal rights to demand a "parking charge" from us never mind one that is for more than they state on the signage?
Any help or advice on our next steps would be much appreciated!

ManxRed

Firstly, no they have no legal rights to demand a penny from you. The landower can theoretically pursue you for their actual losses only, which in a free car park would be zero anyway.

Do you know the registered keeper of the car (don't answer on here)? If its not a lease or hire company and you can have a conversation with the RK, then simply ignore everything this company (and it's pet powerless debt collectors) send you, and do not contact them.

Given the amount they are charging and the discrepancy with the signs, this might be worth a complaint to the DVLA. State that you have received the charge from Civil Enforcement. The charge demanded is in excess of the BPA Code of Practice and at odds with the signage in the car park itself, and hence Civil Enforcement have no reasonable cause to apply for the registered keeper's data. Ask them to confirm that any such request from any private parking company in relation to this incident will meet with a refusal from the DVLA to supply the RK data.

Coupon-mad

Definitely worth reporting to the DVLA as these 'tickets' breach the BPA Code of Practice in 3 or 4 ways:

- the amount exceeds £100 (massively!) which is not only more than the signs say but more than the BPA Code 'suggests' is the maximum.

- the bit about POPLA is in TINY small print at the bottom.

- the name of the company is hidden half way down to disguise the fact it's a private ticket.

- the 'Scales of Justice' and ticket called 'Enforcement Notice' is an impersonation of authority which also breaches the COP and goes against minutes of a BPA meeting this year.

...all as mentioned in this pepipoo thread:

http://forums.pepipoo.com/index.php?showtopic=73843&st=20

Look back at page 1 of that thread as well and you'll find the DVLA email addy. It's easy to complain, no comeback on you (I have complained about several PPC websites) but very possibly there could be serious comeback on Civil Enforcement. We (pepipoo and MSE posters) have already got 6 BPA Approved Operator members banned in recent weeks.

Please stop going back and checking the signs although great spot that the amount is different! The point being that all private parking tickets are unenforceable so don't worry much about your own letters and 'ticket'. You can ignore the fake ticket of course but...how about appealing on that basis as well (on the points above, as well as your own words) and see if you can get this in front of POPLA (second stage appeal) as well as exposed to the DVLA.

mick1812

Many thanks for the very useful information.
I have complained to the DVLA and also the BPA and the company that own this car park!!
Have decided to ignore the tinpot demand from Civil enforcement and if we recieve any more veiled threatning letters from them will file them on the toilet wall with the initial letter!!

Coupon-mad

mick1812 wrote: »

Many thanks for the very useful information.
I have complained to the DVLA and also the BPA and the company that own this car park!!
Have decided to ignore the tinpot demand from Civil enforcement and if we recieve any more veiled threatning letters from them will file them on the toilet wall with the initial letter!!

That's a perfect approach, well done for fighting back! :T

mick1812

Hi
I'm just looking for a few more thoughts that anybody may have on this on going dispute I have.
I have now heard back from the BPA who have offered to investigate my complaint for me, although they have stated they have no legal right to overturn this demand.
The quandary I now find myself in is do I contact Civil Enforcement or not?
The thought that has crossed my mind is to maybe write to them rejecting all claims that they may have to demand payment because of the mentioned breech's and also that my partner has not admitted being the driver and hence matter closed do not contact us again.
Only concern is that they then may push us further?
Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated

The_Slithy_Tove

Don't bother contacting them. They don't care. Even talking about breaches of codes is suggesting that the charge may even be legitimate if those niggles were ironed out. It is not - they can't ask for a single penny in a free car park. The whole premise of their claim is completely bogus, so there's no point in picking holes in something which is fundamentally flawed from the start.

grant_uk

mick1812 wrote: »

Hi
I'm just looking for a few more thoughts that anybody may have on this on going dispute I have.
I have now heard back from the BPA who have offered to investigate my complaint for me, although they have stated they have no legal right to overturn this demand.
The quandary I now find myself in is do I contact Civil Enforcement or not?
The thought that has crossed my mind is to maybe write to them rejecting all claims that they may have to demand payment because of the mentioned breech's and also that my partner has not admitted being the driver and hence matter closed do not contact us again.
Only concern is that they then may push us further?
Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated

Probably not worth the effort. It makes no difference to them whether you appeal or not because their business model relies on people buckling when they read the intimidating letters and paying up, even though closer inspection and research reveals them to have little in the way of enforceability. All replying to them indicates is that you're rattled enough to be a potential panic payer.

taffy056

Why are you even considering contacting the parking company ? They are scammers, and you are asking scammers not to scam you, guess what the answer will be ? If they were named Civil Enforment Nigeria , would you even consider replying to them ? This company and others like them rip people off for a living, they have no morals all they want is your money. Look at my signature where the dvla has banned some from access to the address details. So ignore the scammers

mick1812

After taking some very helpful advice, I chose to ignore what turned out to be 3 letters from Civil enforcement demanding payment. The last was recieved on 17-12-12.
I thought this would be the end of the matter until today, 5 months later!!
I have recieved County court claim form from what looks like northampton county court asking wether I admit to the claim or wish to dispute it!!
This has now bought back concerns over my next step.
Can anyone give me advice or is this another veiled threat from this company??

Stroma

Yes post on https://www.pepipoo.com as quickly as you can, there are number of posters there that can help. I guess they are trying for a figure of £350 or so yes ? The claim is intimidation only and is not meant to really go before a court.

Please acknowledge the claim if its through mcol, and say you are going to defend in full, you'll be given an option to extend the time to formulate your defence to 28 days in total.

Please don't worry about this, CEL are doing a lot of claims right now, and its a departure from their previous stance on this.