Gas fire failed gas safety test - advice please?

norbet

Hi, I have an apartment with a gas fire, gas boiler and gas hob. These items were installed within the last ten years and have been checked yearly as part of my BG Landlord Home Care and until now there have never been any problems.

On my recent CP12 safety check the gas fire has been marked as failed on the flue flow test – the details of the defects are listed as:
"Unable to check flue in loft" "Inadequate clearances"

Remedial action taken states:
"Turned off label attached, Letter left".

I've called BG today to find out why and what I need do, and they said it’s due to a change in gas safe regs and that boiler flues need to be capable of being inspected and that an inspection hatch would be required. I then explained that this was a gas fire where the flue is in the wall and goes up through the flat above into the roof void and to the chimney.

BG then suggested that I have the fire capped off so that it cannot be used.

I'm tempted to follow this advice since I understand the gas fire gets very little use, the tenants use the central heating boiler and rarely use the fire.

Before I contact a gas safe engineer to arrange this, I've had a quick look on the web to try and establish why a previously safe appliance would now be classed as unsafe and whether the BG suggestion that I need to have a hatch fitted is actually true.

I can only find info relating to boiler installations where the flue goes through ceiling or wall voids.
Given that most gas fires in residential properties have flues that go through the wall/chimney at ground floor level and up into the roof void, are the regulations actually insisting that inspection hatches be built into a chimneystack to inspect the flue?
In my situation the apartment is a ground floor flat so there would be no feasible way for the engineer to access the flat above. Do they actually need to?
Can anyone enlighten me as to what my best course of action would be?

Any suggestions and advice would be very welcome.
In the meantime I’ll speak to my tenant and request that they do not use the gas fire until such time as I’ve established why the appliance cannot be tested as safe.

Cheers
N

macman

They are correct, the amended regs are retrospective and apply to existing installs.

norbet

macman wrote: »

They are correct, the amended regs are retrospective and apply to existing installs.

OK I appreciate that macman thanks for your response.

I understand the concept of boiler flues that run through voids such as ceilings and roofs and I appreciate that access to these would be required, I know of landlords for fairly recent new builds (less than years old) having to restropectively install ceiling hatches to access the boiler flue.
I take it you're saying the same applies to gas fires and chimney's?
If this is the case, I guess my only option then is to have the gas fire decomissioned since I cannot provide access to the flat above.

Can someone explain what's necessary for decommissioning a gas fire, does it need to be completed removed, or just isolated so that gas is not supplied to the fire?

southcoastrgi

the new regs they are quoting only apply to gas boilers & not gas fires so they have got that bit totally wrong TB 008 is the reg they are quoting (good old BG), however the chimney or flue has to be able to be inspected through out it's lenght (this hasn't changed it's always been like this) & as they couldn't gain access to the chimney above or the roof space then they are correct, my advice would be just to leave the fire as it is arrange with your upstairs neighbour to be in & re-arrange for BG to come back out. 10 min job to do a smoke & flue flow test

norbet

Thanks for the advice southcoastrgi, thing is this fire has passed in previous years without issue and I'm fairly certain they've never asked for access to the flat above when doing the saftey checks.
There is, I believe, a loft hatch in the communcal stairwell, but I don't know if this has ever been used in previous safety checks/inspections.
I think I need to see a copy of the letter that has been left with my tenant and the label that has been attached (I understand there's different classes of labelling depending on the risk percieved). I'll pop round to see him tonight. Once I have that I'll see if it sheds any more light on the situation.
I've spoken to my tenant who says he's not used the fire in the 2 years he's been there, so at least if I have to get it decomissioned he wont miss it.

southcoastrgi

ok let us know what you find out

gas4you

The full force of the new regs doesn't hit until January 1st 2013.

Until then they could have just fitted 2 or more CO detectors as per TB008.

Seems like BG are jumping the gun again to try to get more work IMO.

I agree with Southcoast though, they are mis-applying this to a fire and chimney.

barumd

The new regulations apply only to fan assisted flue's. They do not apply to conventional gas fires using a natural draught, open flue, chimney system, I assume yours is not a fan assisted gas fire.

Quite what is meant by restricted headroom I do not know, is he too big to get into the loft space!

The "Essential Gas Safety" Domestic 6th edition (current) requirements, in respect of open flued appliances state:
1 Carry out a visual inspection of the whole length of the chimney, where practicable.
2 Check there is provision of adequate combustion/compartment ventilation.
3 Conduct a flue flow test.
4 Conduct an appliance spillage test.

When carrying out the visual inspection there are numerous aspects to be checked of course but sight of each and every part of the chimney are not required.
Personally I would carry out the spillage test first as better a small amount of smoke enters the room as opposed to 5m3.

regards.