Right of Way over shared path

Carrie1983

Hello!

I am looking for a bit of input and/or advice, regarding ROW access.

We have lived in our current house for 3 months now. It is an end terraced Victorian workman's cottage. We are at one end of a row of 4 (rural location, so no other houses around us, although not really relevant anyway). We have a path running up the side of our house (called North West) and across the back of the property, the next door property, next door but one property and finally the other end terrace; the path then runs along her side (South East).

My deeds clearly state that we have ROW over the paths to the rear of the other three properties, and they have ROW over the path to the rear of ours. It does not state that the path is shared; I think each person owns the path attached to their house but that a ROW runs across it - this isn't clear to me as a layman, as it just states ROW over path adjoining (input appreciated).

Our direct neighbouring house is currently empty and on the market. Soon after we moved in, it became obvious that for various reasons, the other end terrace occupants, are at severe odds with the people in their direct neighbouring house (the unreasonable behaviour of lady in neighbouring house, is probably main reason - we have witnessed this ourselves!). Anyway, we are quite happy here, except I want and need to ensure fairness over this ROW, as I don't want to be the householder who is detrimented by this fallout that has ensued for over 20 years!

Let's say my house is number 1, next door is 2 and is empty, then 3 and other end terrace is 4. The woman in number 3 has blocked her path, over which we have right of way (as does number 2 and also number 4). She has a delivery of gas bottles every few weeks, and she stores them on the path, between the original gate and another gate she has erected to shield them. This gate is then padlocked. I didn't realise this until about a month ago when, in passing, I happened to state that we were blocking up a window so our path would be mucky and rubbly for a few days, so she'd probably want to use the other path (people seldom use the path anyway). This is when she said to me that we must keep the path clear at all times as she has no other access to the rear, as she's blocked the other end due to her dispute.

SO, after a few other issues she has caused, I've decided I want to get this sorted out. My deeds state that I have a ROW, and there are times I may need/want to use it. What must I do in order to get her to unblock this access? I don't want to be severely out of pocket, but I don't want her to go on for years thinking she can eventually claim there is no access (if you don't use it you lose it apparently). Besides this, I don't really want my path to be the only means of access - I feel it should be fair to everyone. Not trying to be petty. The woman has also claimed a few feet of the end terrace lady's garden, and land registry are involved at the moment. I am only glad she is not a direct neighbour.

Also, it doesn't say in the deeds, but what can these ROW be used for? She has been bringing garden debris through, and she never clears up her droppings; she's about to have a tree chopped down and wants to bring it over the path. The path is very narrow. Is there particular wording in the deeds I should be looking for.

To complicate things, we are also on a shared private driveway, with a farm at one end (no through road). We all share parking area out the front of our houses, and this has been one source of the problems between these two neighbours. In the deeds, it states we all must share financial responsibility for maintaining the road (which is also a footpath), and this woman, along with another person who lives in another house in the hamlet, and another couple, who call themselves the Committee, are putting pressure on us to contribute a monthly amount to their fund for covering repairs. I would like to have a say over whether repairs are necessary; and as none of the committee have introduced themselves or explained any of the 'initiatives' they are starting, or indeed been asked to be involved in the committee, I don't feel comfortable giving them regular money which they can then use how THEY see fit. If, for instance, a pot hole appears on a piece of the drive several yards beyond the part we ever use, we don't feel we should have to contribute to it. So am hoping the deeds don't legally oblige us.

Anyway, any info about the ROW, would be really appreciated.

Fire_Fox

You need to start communicating with your neighbours, ASK these people what committee they are, what organisation is set up to safeguard your money and how you join. Secondly communicate with the innocent party in the dispute, it is likely to be cheaper to use her solicitor for the right of way access.

If you all have to pay for repairs to the road/ pathway you can't normally pick and choose which you contribute to based on who uses it most. Much as in a block of flats you generally all pay for the roof, lift or foundations regardless of what floor you live on. Check the precise wording of your deeds.

princeofpounds

The shared driveway and the path are two separate issues.

As long as the driveway is genuinely shared and not a freehold/leasehold structure then it's unlikely any self-appointed committee has any real power. Having said that, it makes sense to have a forum for discussing such things, but I doubt a committee with someone from elsewhere in the village is the right way. I would encourage you to work co-operatively on this issue but only with the people who should be involved.

In terms of coercion in this sort of situation, really all that normally can happen is that one resident takes another to court to get an order to meet their obligation. And those obligations, in the absence of anything specified, are normally just to keep it serviceable, not pretty. But again, a little goodwill can go a long way.

Check out gardenlaw forums for a wealth of info and advice on these matters.

As for the right of way, it's pretty clear that she should not be locking her gate. It's up to you whether you want to start the dispute over that one or not. Disputes can get nasty and expensive, although in this case it sounds like a pretty straightforward situation. Remember that you would have to declare any disputes if you sold the house onward.

In the absence of anything specified, she is probably allowed to use the right of way for basically anything it has been used for historically. So any foot traffic, and anything that can be wheeled or carried on foot. That doesn't mean she is allowed to litter or damage it however, merely pass and re-pass.

Again, this is all just fairly general stuff and I can'y claim 100% precision on the matter, so do visit gardenlaw (and, if it gets to that stage, neighbours from hell forums!)

Land_Registry

Carrie1983 wrote: »

My deeds clearly state that we have ROW over the paths to the rear of the other three properties, and they have ROW over the path to the rear of ours. It does not state that the path is shared; I think each person owns the path attached to their house but that a ROW runs across it - this isn't clear to me as a layman, as it just states ROW over path adjoining (input appreciated).

My deeds state that I have a ROW, and there are times I may need/want to use it. What must I do in order to get her to unblock this access? I don't want to be severely out of pocket, but I don't want her to go on for years thinking she can eventually claim there is no access (if you don't use it you lose it apparently).

Also, it doesn't say in the deeds, but what can these ROW be used for? She has been bringing garden debris through, and she never clears up her droppings; she's about to have a tree chopped down and wants to bring it over the path. The path is very narrow. Is there particular wording in the deeds I should be looking for./QUOTE]

The manner in which a registered title refers to such ROWs can vary from a simple statement 'The land has a right of way over the shared path to the side and rear of the property' to a more detailed one, often combined with other easements (rights) and set out on the register or in a referred to document/deed.

You say that it 'just states ROW over path adjoining' so I would guess that it is a simple entry/note as to having the ROW and another for the part which is included in your title and used by the other house owners.

In simple terms if you have a ROW then it should not lapse over time through lack of use. This and ensuring that you are able to exercise the ROW is something you should though seek legal advice on.

I have heard of examples where owners have padlocked gates but then give the neighbour a key so that their ROW can be used etc but invariably, and as you refer to, other issues of 'neighbourliness' can come into play re such things

If the entry/note re the ROW is in the very simplest form then what it means in reality is often open to conjecture. But if the ROW specifically refers to 'the path' and it is the original path still in place then it is likely that there are no limitations on it's use other than natural ones due to it's width - again this is something to discuss with a legal adviser as if such matters are to be challenged then this and any subsequent enforcement would be dealt with through the courts.

In the circumstances you may wish to consider checking the registered titles for the neighbouring properties (if all registered of course) as well just in case they offer more insight into the ROW - if the properties were built and sold and therefore registered at roughly the same time then I doubt if they will reveal anything extra but for the sake of clarity it is sometimes worth checking

The advice from Fire Fox might be a useful opportunity to compare titles as well of course and discuss the issues over the ROW. We would always recommend neighbours finding an agreement and compromise to resolve such matters as recourse through the courts can be very costly indeed.

You can check the registered titles for each property online.

Let us know how things develop and I hope they are resolved amicably.

princeofpounds

In the circumstances you may wish to consider checking the registered titles for the neighbouring properties (if all registered of course) as well just in case they offer more insight into the ROW

3x2x£4 = Land registry sales

Actually, I'm just joking around, this is actually a good idea if you want to be more sure of your position as different deeds do sometimes contain different information.

Carrie1983

Wow, thank you for the great responses!

Really helpful and I will go through and read properly and act on any advice.

I don't really want to get involved in any disputes, but don't want to lose any rights we have, so was in a quandary over that. We are the type of couple that like to keep ourselves to ourselves; we have tried to introduce ourselves to members of the committee but it's like a secret organisation! Ha! The lady on the end (innocent party) doesn't have a problem with the ROW being blocked, as she has access along the side to the rear of her house. I guess it would be different if she were a mid terrace occupant.

Re the road: we don't really have a problem contributing to repairs, but would rather do so from our pocket and not have to set up a monthly contribution. Also, we do feel a bit resentful that we are on of 6 cottages at this end of the drive, and there is another quarter of a mile of drive between the end of this row of cottages and the farm. After the farm is another 8 cottages. The farmer is using the drive constantly, with heavy machinery, and obviously the cottages at the end, use the entire drive. I think the solicitor told us when we queried this (it is actually in the deeds that we contribute), it is usually done based on proportion of use, which is what leads me to feeling we should really have some say over repairs, rather than it being decided by one member of a community just because they are the treasurer for eg. Really tricky to get the head round, but we tend to save for household repairs in general anyway, so we would rather do it on that basis than contribute to a fund that we don't really have any say over.

I was pillow talking with my husband in the wee hours, and as he said, this blocked ROW doesn't really affect us as we have access down the side and to the rear. Number 2 would usually use this path anyway, as that would make sense. So all it means is that number 3 - ignorant neighbour who blocked path - also has to use the path, and as she rarely uses it, it doesn't present much of a problem. I suppose I just don't like to think of people taking other people's rights away.

I will read all your advice and input properly.x

GDB2222

These sorts of disputes can become ruinously expensive. At some point, the original dispute gets forgotten, and it all boils down to who is liable to pay the costs, which can easily mount up to 5 figures. Occasionally, you hear about neighbours spending £100k slogging something minor out.

None of what you have talked about is worth that sort of hassle. Do try to sort this out amicably. If that can't be done, just grin and bear it.

Land_Registry

princeofpounds wrote: »

3x2x£4 = Land registry sales

Actually, I'm just joking around, this is actually a good idea if you want to be more sure of your position as different deeds do sometimes contain different information.

I appreciate the big grin from princeofpounds and did try to emphasise that in some cases making such multiple-checks are not always necessary but if things are to be pursued legally etc then such information is likely to be required.
The good news is the £4 figure quoted comes down to £3 on 22nd October as well though but the choice of making any further checks is entirely yours.

It sounds as if the driveway issue could be of greater concern and I wish you luck in resolving - if the deeds state who pays what and on what basis it is likely to again come down to discussing it with each other and reaching a mutual agreement. Quite how that works with the remainder of the drive depends on whether that is also mentioned in the titles (inc the farmer's) as well.

tonyh66

No 4 is happy because no one is crossing their bit, No 3 is happy because no one is crossing their bit, although they are crossing Nos 1 and 2.
How about you gateing off your part and locking it as No 3 has done, and see how no 3 gets access then?

Fire_Fox

Nothing stopping you 'applying' to join the committee then negotiating with the farmer for him to pay most of the costs, given the heavy machinery which is probably causing the lion's share of the damage. It may be the roadway needs to be strengthened.

My parents' apartment block has grounds and car parks, the latter used by staff of an adjacent organisation. A representative of the board of directors negotiated splitting the costs of repairs to the car park based on past and future use. To be honest tho it was over fifteen years of daily use by cars before the repairs were required to the car park, and the main body of it was a collapsed drain not the general surface. If your repairs are more frequent I'd be looking to the farmer.

princeofpounds

The good news is the £4 figure quoted comes down to £3 on 22nd October as well though but the choice of making any further checks is entirely yours.

Official charges coming down?! I think I just saw a pig fly past my window!

Well, I have no idea why this is happening, and it's only a quid (though I'm sure not for the Registry!), but I'll say thanks just because it's great to see some efficiency