ESA Migration the best way forward/options.

sunnyone

Many, many people have been transfered to ESA from IB with no problems what so ever, I was transfered to the support group without even being seen face to face and Im certainly not alone.

You are causing yourself stress and worry without reason, you havn't been seen never mind been refused ESA so why not let the process take its course and worry when you have a reason too?

The best course of action at present is to concentrate on gatering evidence to support your claim to ensure you get the right result from the WCA.

And to read up on the criteria for ESA.

Simon7685

I beg to differ, I have every reason to worry and be concerned over any assessment carried out by ATOS.

I have been assessed by an ATOS doctor previously. The 'Doctor' lied, not stretched or twisted the truth, he lied. Not once but several times in his written report. I proved that he lied, so I think I every reason to worry about their 'assessments'.

Add to that the latest set of Govt statistics which state that 55% of claimants are refused ESA. Out of the 45% that are awarded ESA more than half are placed in the WRAG group with a view to being placed in work at a later stage.

I appreciate that some people are awarded ESA, some without face to face assessment. However the majority are not, even people diagnosed with terminal illnesses are being refused, unless they have 6 months or less to live. So everyone who is being put through this awful process needs to be worried. We are however all entitled to our opinions:)

benefitbaby

Simon7685 wrote: »

Now at present I receive Income Support on the grounds of disability (Couple Rate) and a disability premium. I also get DLA (Renewed in June 2012) high rate mobility and low rate care.

As I understand it, if I appeal my income would remain unchanged whilst waiting for the appeal, as the assessment rate for a couple is the same as the IS rate I receive. Also the disability premium would continue as I qualify for it through my DLA. If this is incorrect then please feel free to correct me.

No, when you appeal a failed WCA assessment you are paid the assessment rate of ESA only - no disability premium I'm afraid as these do not exist with ESA law and so cannot be paid regardless of the DLA awarded. If you subsequently win your appeal your full entitlement will be reinstated and backdated but instead of a disability premium you will receive a 'work related activity component'.

So if I accept the decision .... and claim JSA, I would still receive the same amount each week to live off, including the disability premium as I get DLA.

Disability premiums are indeed payable in JSA

Is it not the Job Centres Roll to facilitate a return to the workplace by helping me find suitable employment that my disabilities allow me to do?

Wouldn't that be lovely... it would be your responsibility to seek appropriate/suitable work, but they could amend your jobseekers agreement to take account of your limitations.

benefitbaby

Simon7685 wrote: »

I beg to differ, I have every reason to worry and be concerned over any assessment carried out by ATOS.

I have been assessed by an ATOS doctor previously. The 'Doctor' lied, not stretched or twisted the truth, he lied. Not once but several times in his written report. I proved that he lied, so I think I every reason to worry about their 'assessments'.

I do hope you made a formal complaint to Atos and also to the GMC.

Add to that the latest set of Govt statistics which state that 55% of claimants are refused ESA. Out of the 45% that are awarded ESA more than half are placed in the WRAG group with a view to being placed in work at a later stage.

These statistics are not an accurate reflection because they do not take into account revised decisions and appeal successes which change the picture significantly.

even people diagnosed with terminal illnesses are being refused, unless they have 6 months or less to live.

The legal test for teminal illness in benefit law is that the person is 'reasonably expected to die within 6 months' and the decision makers have no discretionary power to go behind the law.

Simon7685

Update................

the dreaded WCA came around today. I attended as required, I asked if the WCA was being recorded as I requested and they said no, there was no record of a request in the file.......... Well there's a surprise!!!

I had a copy of the letters sent to both ATOS and DWP, so they cancelled the WCA and advised they will contact me with a date when they can have the necessary equipment available.

Had I not asked, they had no intention of telling me it wasn't going to be recorded. No record in the file? Why not? Does this company know what it is doing?

So after all the worry and stress of preparing for this, it still hasn't happened. I have written to the DWP informing them of what has occured and what ATOS have done, also included I have asked for written confirmation that there will be no benefit sanctions as a result of ATOS not doing their job properly.

Parva

So you're being deliberately obstinate in order to prolong 'due process'? I'm not sure they'll agree to continue to pay you without sanctions and frankly why should they? It would have been far easier to take the 'test' and then argue about it later if it didn't go your way (which is what I suspect you know already, recording or no recording).

Murphymycat

I hope you get the result you want. I have just been awarded ESA for the second time without having to undergo another WCA. I wrote both Atos and DWP a detailed letter requesting that any WCA be recorded and included this within my application. I also got written proof that my MP was prepared to get involved if necessary.

Before I was awarded ESA for the first time I was claiming JSA and personally found this to be far more stressful than the ESA process.
Having looked at many forums on this subject I have concluded it can be a bit of a postcode lottery on how people are treated.

Simon7685

Parva wrote: »

So you're being deliberately obstinate in order to prolong 'due process'? I'm not sure they'll agree to continue to pay you without sanctions and frankly why should they? It would have been far easier to take the 'test' and then argue about it later if it didn't go your way (which is what I suspect you know already, recording or no recording).

Er NO I am not being deliberately obstinate to prolong the due process. I asked for my WCA to be recorded, which I have a right to do. I have very good grounds for asking for it. Having been subjected to a terrible assessment by ATOS previously. Where the doctor visited me at home and then wrote blatant lies in his report. A report that was thrown out by the appeal tribunal as being unsafe. He even lied about the results of a medical process carried out in a hospital by a consultant. So do I have grounds for not trusting ATOS, and am not just being obstinate? I have grounds not to trust this compnay who it is well documented, twist things and do not make accurate assessments.

I did not get the option to carry on with the assessment as it happens. When I asked whether it was being recorded they said no and stated that they would be cancel it until they could record it. I requested a recorded WCA which I am allowed to do, it is not my fault that they could not get their act together to facilitate that request.

I have done nothing wrong, or asked for anything that I am not entitled to ask for.

With regards your other statement,
" It would have been far easier to take the 'test' and then argue about it later if it didn't go your way (which is what I suspect you know already, )
Yes it may have been easier to go ahead with the assessment (it is not a test) but I asked for it to be recorded, which covers me and the assessor in the event of any discrepancies later claimed by either party. It is not my fault they did not do their jobs correctly and organize it.

Also YES I do suspect that the result of the WCA will not go in my favour. Most WCA's do not go in the favour of the claimant, which then results in a lengthly costly appeal process. If that WCA is recorded then there is an accurate reflection as to whether it was carried out correctly or not. Just because I expect I might not pass any assessment does mean that that assessment process is fair and fit for purpose, nor does it suggest that I am some sort of malingerer sponging of the state, which I feel is what you are trying to suggest.

The Government said that claimants were entitled to ask for their WCA to be recorded. I asked for this, when I attended and asked about it they said NO it wasn't being recorded. They then offered to cancel the WCA until they could do a recorded one, which I accepted. I have not refused to go ahead with an assessment, so I should not be subject to a sanction for something I haven't done.

Simon7685

Murphymycat wrote: »

I hope you get the result you want. I have just been awarded ESA for the second time without having to undergo another WCA. I wrote both Atos and DWP a detailed letter requesting that any WCA be recorded and included this within my application. I also got written proof that my MP was prepared to get involved if necessary.

Before I was awarded ESA for the first time I was claiming JSA and personally found this to be far more stressful than the ESA process.
Having looked at many forums on this subject I have concluded it can be a bit of a postcode lottery on how people are treated.

Thank you for your support, it nice to know that not everyone thinks you are being "deliberately obstinate" just because you want to ensure you are treated fairly by a company that have a terrible track record of doing just that.

Simon7685

Just to clarify something here as the tone of Parva's comments #17 have quite upset me.

If as a result of any ESA assessment I was placed in the WRAG group, I would be happy. I have not worked since 2006, when I had my own business, a decent income and good lifestyle. I lost all that as a result of serious illness. I would prefer not to have to spend the rest of my life on state benefits, up until becoming ill I had always worked, paid my taxes and supported others by doing so.

All I want is to be treated fairly by a system that is not fair in the way it treats people. The whole idea behind ESA is to get people off sickness benefits and back into work. I actually agree with what they are trying to do but not how they are doing it. If they came to me tomorrow and said right we will continue to support you with your benefits and at the same time give you the help you would need to get back into employment I would accept that without question. I think most people would. However that is not what is happening, they are finding people with health problems and disabilities fit for work and pushing them onto JSA, where they are treated the same as someone who is perfectly fit and this leads to an unfair, unlevel playing field. There are a lot of jobs I cannot physically do and of those that I could do I am at a disadvantage when applying. There are not many employers out there that would take someone with disabilities over someone who was perfectly fit and well, that is a fact. So people in my situation need some extra help over and above what others may need. We do not need to be unfairly judged by others that do not know what our personal situations are.

Just because I want a fair system and want what I am entitled to ask for, a recorded WCA does not make me deliberately obstinate or obstructive for not going ahead with an unrecorded one. I asked for a recording, they then arranged one that wasn't gong to be recorded. When I raised the issue, they said they would cancel until they could provide it, which is to their credit but I have not done anything wrong here.