Help needed - Ebay dispute

Benfiesta

Hi all

I really need some advice and have been told this is the place to get it


I have recently been selling off done displays etc from my late father in law's kitchen shop after he passed away in June. Up to now all has been fine but I now have an issue with the last kitchen to go


It was the 'working' kitchen in the shop and used by staff and was sold as such and was still in good condition


The item was purchased using the 'Best Offer' option on my listing and the buyer came to collect the kitchen. She at no point prior to purchase or collection asked any questions about the item


When she came to collect it, she expressed concern that 3 of the units were not the standard 600mm depth and were not floor units as she had expected. I explained and showed her pictures of the units again on the listing. In fairness the depth measurements were not included, but nor were they for any of the units


She also took away several pieces of granite and solid stone worktop with the kitchen, these were not included in the listing but were given as they obviously were cut for the kitchen, she did not pay for these. Everything was collected and paid for and she went away very happy.


This morning she then sends me a message on eBay saying I have mislead her and ripped her off. She states that I gave her the incorrect eorktops, which is not only a lie, but she didn't buy worktops anyway. And that I mislead her with regard to the size of these 3 units. She says I forced her into buying it and that she couldn't inspect it as it was dismantled. She wants a full refund and for me to cover her costs.


My feeling is that whilst she expressed concern over unit size on collection, she had every opportunity to refuse to proceed with the purchase, it took over 2 hours for ME to load it into her van do she had plenty of time. She'd driven from Liverpool to Guildford for this kitchen so you would think she would inspect it properly. I feel she is just trying to get out of buying it (her husband made clear he didn't waft a new kitchen' and is using this as an excuse


Anyway, she's now entered a dispute, also stating that I've ignored her contact, not true, I replied within 10 minutes. What I would like avoid us eBay issuing a refund as this is not my money and I feel that I would either never see the kitchen again, or at best it would be damaged. Either way, I no longer have anywhere to store it


Sorry for the long post, any advice would be greatly welcomed....


Thanks


Ben

techspec

I assume you let them pay with paypal - never a good idea for collection.

You should always put sizes in listings.

Thats said - they inspected it and still bought.

Ebay will side with them - they always do - so it may be best offering a refund on return.

You dont have to pay any costs.

Benfiesta

No they didn't pay with PayPal, they paid cash on collection.

I can't see why I should give a refund when she inspected it and took it, not like a held a gun to her head or anything. If I take it back then it'll have to be scrapped as I've now got nowhere to store it

Crowqueen

If you are selling these as part of a business (as they are ex-display models I believe you may be), the buyer has additional rights, including time to examine the items at home - your responsibilities don't end when the buyer leaves your premises.

Have a look at what might apply to you here and make a decision about what to do:

http://www.oft.gov.uk/business-advice/treating-customers-fairly/sogahome/

Benfiesta

It wasn't sold as a business. It was a private sale of a used kitchen, not ex display

The issue isn't anything to do with condition. Her problem is with the size, which she knew before she took it away. If she had told me at point of collection that she was mistaken and she didn't want it, then fair enough, but she has taken it quite happily and then later decided she's not happy. The measurements haven't changed on the motorway home

THEMONEYSPIDER_2

I sell a few items for local collection, never occured to me a buyer may pick something up and the open a dispute about the item, especially if they have paid cash on collection.

So does anybody know where you would stand should the buyer then open a dispute after they have taken the item??

Ben, its already been said, its always the best idea to put measurements when listing such items, especially has the units she's now concerned about are "not standard 600mm" as you said. That said though, she could of said when viewing the kitchen that it wasn't what she had thought and decided not to take it.

Im not certain but i think, buy it now / best offers have different rules to auction sales.

What is your buyer actually asking you to do about the situation? do they want to return it, or are they asking for some money back ect?

Benfiesta

Oh I admit that it was an oversight not including the measurements, though I do think the pictures make it obvious. But as you say, she acknowledged this and took it anyway

She actually told me she wants to return it for a full refund and for me to pay her £200+ fuel costs but the dispute is just for a return and full refund. We've got nowhere discussing it between ourselves so I've told her to escalate it to Customer Services to make a decision

theonlywayisup

Benfiesta wrote: »

Oh I admit that it was an oversight not including the measurements, though I do think the pictures make it obvious. But as you say, she acknowledged this and took it anyway

She actually told me she wants to return it for a full refund and for me to pay her £200+ fuel costs but the dispute is just for a return and full refund. We've got nowhere discussing it between ourselves so I've told her to escalate it to Customer Services to make a decision

The dispute will either close in your favour or hers. What will be certain is that Ebay are not in a position to force you to pay her fuel costs.

terra_ferma

Benfiesta wrote: »

It wasn't sold as a business. It was a private sale of a used kitchen, not ex display

The issue isn't anything to do with condition. Her problem is with the size, which she knew before she took it away. If she had told me at point of collection that she was mistaken and she didn't want it, then fair enough, but she has taken it quite happily and then later decided she's not happy. The measurements haven't changed on the motorway home

it's not a private sale, it's part of the winding down of the business, and the sale will have to be declared in the next tax return (there are special rules for that).
That money is taxable, the kitchen came out as an expense when it was built (the materials I expect), the money needs to go back in the business as income.

My understanding is that distance selling regulations don't apply as she saw the kitchen before she purchased it, so she can't cancel the contracts and return it.

In terms of ebay, they will not be able to force you to refund.

Conditions under which a case can be filed

Buyers can file a case under the eBay Buyer Protection policy only when all of the following are true:

• You paid with PayPal to the seller’s nominated PayPal account. (If you have not paid with PayPal you should still enter your case as eBay will try, as set out below, to facilitate a resolution with the seller.)

http://pages.ebay.co.uk/help/policies/buyer-protection.html#conditions

PS HMRC will ask for details about the assets and stock belonging to the business in your next tax return.

Benfiesta

Oh no I certainly won't reimburse those, and will make the return as difficult as possible if that's the way it goes, since I've not even got anywhere to store it now

terra_ferma

Benfiesta wrote: »

Oh no I certainly won't reimburse those, and will make the return as difficult as possible if that's the way it goes, since I've not even got anywhere to store it now

a business transaction on ebay is not 'sold as seen', it's not wise to sell something and not being able to take it back if something goes wrong.
You need to take some responsibility for the sale, if it was me I would not be very happy to buy from a 'private' seller and end up collecting from a shop. My attitude would change, maybe after going home and thinking it over.
You need to take some responsibility, a cash payment and collection does not exonerate you from the fact that it was a business transaction.

I'm not saying you should refund, if the kitchen is as described and fit for purpose, I'm not an expert on face-to-face transactions, but you need to take responsibility for what is in all effects a business transaction.