Full structural survey, should I be worried?

francohoops

Hi,
We've had an offer accepted on a 1930s end of terrace house and have just got the full structural survey back. The surveyor verbally assured us that in his opinion there was nothing that should put us off going ahead with the purchase. I've now gone through the survey in detail and there are quite a few points that sound potentially serious. I've listed them below. What should I be looking for in terms of assurance from the vendors or/and do I need to get specialists in to have a look in more detail? (Bold are extracts from report)

Drainage
It would be prudent to commission inspection reports on services, including underground drainage, by reputable specialists in plumbing and electrics, prior to your
commitment to purchase.

Precautionary enquiries should be made by your solicitor as to whether there is any history of problems with the underground drainage system (according to vendor's solicitors, in the 2 years that they have been in the property there has been no issues). Surveyor's point is based on fact that drains are original.

Do I need to get a drainage expert's report?

Subsidence
The property is constructed on shrinkable clay, and substantial deciduous trees within close proximity to the building. This places the building in the high risk insurance category for subsidence and land slip. It is therefore imperative that the property is adequately insured against subsidence and land slip and this should be confirmed prior to your commitment to purchase.

There is no indication of subsidence, surveyor confirmed that. Should I be concerned about the clay type and trees?

Removal of chimney breast
The original layout to ground floor is likely to have been altered to remove partitions between front and rear reception, including removal of chimney breast to former front room. Although there are currently no indications of structural failure derived from alterations and the alternative support installed, your solicitor should enquire as to whether Building Regulation consent has been obtained for the removal of the original internal partitions and associated works.

What should I expect the vendor to provide me with in this instance? Since they didn't do the work, is there a way that I can check myself e.g. would the local council kepe a record of this?

Woodworm
It is understood the property has been treated against woodworm, to an isolated area. Your solicitor should confirm whether a guarantee from a reputable firm is available and can be transferred to new owners. The guarantee documents should indicate the extent and location of the woodworm treatment. Because of the extent of unexposed and inaccessible timbers, it cannot be stated that the property is free from such defects. My inspection revealed no significant timber infestations.

I'm a bit disappointed that the surveyor didn't go into this in more detail. There is a guarantee, but I'm concerned that there may be more issues. Should I be?

Grateful for your thoughts, opinions and suggestions. We really like the house and hope it all goes through, but I do want to make sure we have an idea of any potential problems prior to us completing.

F

Mrs_Z

Hi, I'm no expert but there is nothing on those statements that would put me off buying the house. It's more the Surveyor covering his back.Drainage - surveyor can not ascertain if there are issues, that's why he is recommending a specialised report.Subsidence - he's stated there is no sign or subsidence, therefore just make sure your buildings insurance covers you for the possibility. This is standard stuff for any house.Chimney brest - not sure if this type of works requires the local council to be notified but if it does they will have paperwork on their files and your Solicitor should ask them.Woodworm - an area has been treated full stop. Whether or not the guarantee can be transferred to the new owners or not does not change that fact. If more/additional infestations occur you just get them treated and pay for it. To me it is not a show stopper.With older houses there are always something that gives concern. When we bought ours in 1996, the survey report recommended that it would have been prudent to install roof vents to the loft - but we havent and there have been no issues. It also recommended that it would be prudent to re-point the chimney - we got round to it last year.... only because we needed to replace a broken tile on the roof.

sten_super

There is nothing there that would worry me unduly. Surveyors tend to cover themselves by refusing to 'sign off' anything they can't be 100% sure about at inspection, and all of these items fall into this category as far as I can see.

If you are concerned, hire specialists to come and look at the issues - but beware that it will cost you.

propertyman

Comments about Surveyors covering their backs are just silly- inspection reports have their limits and the Surveyor has said so.

1: Tests A survey, unless asked, does not include a full test of the plumbing electrics boiler or drains.

• As the property is not new he is recommending that these be tested so that you don't find problems or surprise expenses.
• Nice new outlets may cover up old or overloaded wiring, a look down the drain looks nice and clean but won't show tree roots in the runs.

2: Subsidence What more can he say, the soil and trees make it a higher risk and harder and more expensive to get insurance.

• He suggests you check you can insure at a reasonable costs and without a high excess.
• Bear in mind that your purchaser in x years might have the same concerns.

3: Woodworm Can you please read it again!

C'mon he said that his inspection revealed no infestation but has said there is a lot of unexposed or timber , and given a past inspection or treatment which might just have been the loft, not the whole house, so he cannot say woodworm free or covered by guarantee!


He is telling you that you should

• check the current guarantee and if it is assignable to new owners and not just the original customer
• consider a specialist inspection by an expert in woodworm - surveyors aren't, and they cannot see behind plastered walls.

4 Chimney Breast As he said your solicitor should check and this will be part of the local searches- tell your solicitor. It doesn't matter who did the work there is always the chance of enforcement and that the work may fail sooner than if done properly, especially if you do have future movement.


Good luck hope this helps

sten_super

propertyman wrote: »

Comments about Surveyors covering their backs are just silly- inspection reports have their limits and the Surveyor has said so.

I don't really understand this - 'covering their backs' is exactly what they are doing, and for exactly the reason you highlight. Just because he's covering his back doesn't mean that it's not prudent to do so. He's effectively saying that there are things that he has not been able to check, and that the buyer may want to get checked by someone else.

What I do have a slight issue with though is the tone used by surveyors. As the number of posts here demonstrate, they use slightly alarmist language (to legally cover themselves), the meaning of which is often not clear to the buyer. It obviously depends upon the surveyor - mine talked me through his findings first, explaining that while there were some issues that he was going to highlight in the report they weren't in any way major; and I then wasn't surprised when these appeared in the report.

propertyman

sten_super wrote: »

I Just because he's covering his back doesn't mean that it's not prudent to do so. He's effectively saying that there are things that he has not been able to check, and that the buyer may want to get checked by someone else..

It's still a stupid comment and a silly response sten.

It's based on the false and imagined premise that the survey is all encompassing - it isn't walls cannot be opened up and carpets taken up nor 3 inch drain pipes 10 foot underground inspected, unless it has been agreed that they will be.

There is no need nor is it right to label it as such if the surveyor have not been engaged to or it is beyond their remit or ability to comment.

As they aren't, there are limitations ,and therefore no back to have to cover.

It is also says a lot about a buyer that it implies they will stab the surveyor in the back rather than accept the limitations of the beast and on the advice of the surveyor follow up with specialists or invasive inspection.

Moreover as to tone the position is to inspect and explain, if the purchaser is relying on tone then they are drawing inferences on which to base their conclusion rather than the facts and advice...

When the report arrives ask the questions don't look for indications, understand, its a huge purchase and issues may have different implications for different purchasers - that creaking woodworm riddled roof is a: ok as we want to covert the roof anyway or b omg we cant afford that.

Being called first is a good sign and is more often available from a paid and directly instructed surveyor than a factory service sold by lenders and agents.

Yorkie1

Surely the reason for putting the caveats in, is partly to manage the buyer's expectations.

I do not think it unusual for buyers, particularly those who haven't bought before or been on here, to expect the surveyor to provide a fully comprehensive survey ie. including electrics etc. And if/when things go wrong at a later date, the first thing they'd do is look to see whether the surveyor warned them and complain etc if there was no warning.

So the surveyor makes it clear that he is not an expert that if you want an expert's report you should get a separate one.

propertyman

It's not about expectations as explaining that there are limits to what they do.

I am not surprised about the level of laziness of home buyers who insist on imposing their groundless expectations rather than taking the time to understand and learn about the process that they are relying on to buy the single most important thing in their life.

Friends don't discuss house buying with me as they know they will get told off

The point of sites like this is not to and take away that EA's are liars solicitors lazy and never reply,and surveyors take your money for nothing because of caveats,, and reinforce your own suspicions, but to

• learn from them and
• research, learn and ask question

Before you pick a house and then the IKEA catalog - sort out the bricks and mortar first.


Internet can be used for that rather than"commenting"