Can a daycare nursery be too flash?

alinwales

Having been let down a bit by our existing nursery (records not kept very well, plus they only spell our son's name right 50% of the time, and now they are closed for 6 weeks for essential repairs that could have been picked up on earlier), we are looking at alternatives close by.

One that my wife visited on Friday was very nice. Very very nice. It's only 6 months old, every thing is shiny and new, all very posh stuff- the owners seem to be very strict about what toys they get, all wooden and the like, none of the cheapo plastic tat that we seemed to have accumulated (mostly through the mother in law!).
Other quirky things (imo) -
- their chef comes from a 5* hotel, and she 'cooks' themed things, turning food into animals or whatever. Sounds good, hope it doesn't mean we have to do the same at home to keep him eating there as well!
- there is no (that the wife remembers) childrens' art on the walls, plus displays are all bought-in - no letters cut out of paper and the like. There's not bright colours anywhere ("it overstimulates" they say)
- they treat their staff well paying over the normal rates, which is obviously a good thing. They all got taken on a trip to Harrods apparently. And probably bought stuff for the nursery there too!
- the kids were outside when the wife was shown around, and it was spotless. Absolutely spotless. I would expect neat and tidy, but to the point of OCD? there was a bowl of coloured rice in the foyer/hallway that my son liked to throw around, and my wife felt really guilty that he was making a mess because of how spotless it was.

Now this may be like the nursery that you send your kiddies to... and I'm certainly not knocking it, I'm hopefully going to take a look tonight. The care of the children comes first obviously and as long as the staff are happy and kind then generally that's the biggest tick a place can get (and we have been to nurseries where the staff just can't be bothered).
I also see the positives of the environment on our son, who is a typical 2 year old, with far too much energy and requires constant attention. A calmer environment might encourage him to start to sit longer, pay more attention etc.
But it doesn't sem to ring true for some reason. Do the managers spend more time and attention on the environment than on the children... or is their obsessiveness due to loving children so much?

Mojisola

alinwales wrote: »

It's only 6 months old, every thing is shiny and new, all very posh stuff- the owners seem to be very strict about what toys they get, all wooden and the like, none of the cheapo plastic tat that we seemed to have accumulated

- there is no (that the wife remembers) childrens' art on the walls, plus displays are all bought-in - no letters cut out of paper and the like. There's not bright colours anywhere ("it overstimulates" they say)

- they treat their staff well paying over the normal rates, which is obviously a good thing. They all got taken on a trip to Harrods apparently.

- the kids were outside when the wife was shown around, and it was spotless. Absolutely spotless. I would expect neat and tidy, but to the point of OCD?

But it doesn't sem to ring true for some reason. Do the managers spend more time and attention on the environment than on the children... or is their obsessiveness due to loving children so much?

I would be concerned at some of these things.

If the children's work isn't good enough to be displayed, how does that make them feel?

If the children are expected to be calm and quiet all day, do they go bonkers when you get them home because they've got to let off steam at some point.

How much does it cost if the staff are being taken out to Harrods?!

I'd want to stay there for long enough to get a feel for how the children are treated and what they're allowed to do and how the staff interact with them.

Elle7

alinwales wrote: »

Having been let down a bit by our existing nursery (records not kept very well, plus they only spell our son's name right 50% of the time, and now they are closed for 6 weeks for essential repairs that could have been picked up on earlier), we are looking at alternatives close by.

One that my wife visited on Friday was very nice. Very very nice. It's only 6 months old, every thing is shiny and new, all very posh stuff- the owners seem to be very strict about what toys they get, all wooden and the like, none of the cheapo plastic tat that we seemed to have accumulated (mostly through the mother in law!).
Other quirky things (imo) -
- their chef comes from a 5* hotel, and she 'cooks' themed things, turning food into animals or whatever. Sounds good, hope it doesn't mean we have to do the same at home to keep him eating there as well!
- there is no (that the wife remembers) childrens' art on the walls, plus displays are all bought-in - no letters cut out of paper and the like. There's not bright colours anywhere ("it overstimulates" they say)
- they treat their staff well paying over the normal rates, which is obviously a good thing. They all got taken on a trip to Harrods apparently. And probably bought stuff for the nursery there too!
- the kids were outside when the wife was shown around, and it was spotless. Absolutely spotless. I would expect neat and tidy, but to the point of OCD? there was a bowl of coloured rice in the foyer/hallway that my son liked to throw around, and my wife felt really guilty that he was making a mess because of how spotless it was.

Now this may be like the nursery that you send your kiddies to... and I'm certainly not knocking it, I'm hopefully going to take a look tonight. The care of the children comes first obviously and as long as the staff are happy and kind then generally that's the biggest tick a place can get (and we have been to nurseries where the staff just can't be bothered).
I also see the positives of the environment on our son, who is a typical 2 year old, with far too much energy and requires constant attention. A calmer environment might encourage him to start to sit longer, pay more attention etc.
But it doesn't sem to ring true for some reason. Do the managers spend more time and attention on the environment than on the children... or is their obsessiveness due to loving children so much?

Sounds like a nursery I used to work at.

Remember that nurseries get messed up and tidied up several times a day - when the children are outside, it's a great time to clean up and keep everything hygienic.

With regards to toys and trips to Harrods, the parents of a couple of boys in particular would always offer us something like this - and management preferred it to putting a wad of cash behind the bar on a Christmas night out. The nursery benefits, so I'm not sure why it's an issue, really.

We had a chef who came from a posh hotel too - she got bored of cooking the same posh meals for businessmen, and much preferred the interaction with children and making healthy meals interesting. It meant children who usually refused food at nursery would tuck in, and everyone was happier.

We also had professional displays, but there were boards for children's art too, and every child had a folder full of art for mummy and daddy to look at too. The professional boards simply lasted longer, and made changing themes often to keep them interesting much easier.

You might also agree on bright colours and over-stimulation, once he's been for a while. It doesn't mean that he won't burn energy - we had several periods through the day where we'd go running outside, or do energetic dancing, or play active games, or go on nature walks.

I'd send him for a trial period (a fortnight to a month depending on how quickly he's likely to settle in) and re-evaluate then. I get the feeling you'll be pleasantly surprised, like all our parents were. They had clean, happy and well-fed children going home from a pristine nursery - but they'd have had a whale of a time painting everything, running around and learning, too.

memoryoftrees

I think if it's only 6 months old it's possible the owners are still finding their feet a bit and if you decide to send your son there you may find there's an opportunity to make comments or suggestions and perhaps you could mention the art work and so on?

It may well be that the place was spruced up in anticipation of your wife's visit - I wouldn't worry too much about this.

The food sounds delicious :rotfl:so I'd just roll with that to be honest I think as you said, the key things are that the child is happy and if he has a good key-worker who will build a loving relationship with him and keep a strong dialogue with you that is really what matters. Good luck with it!

marisco_2

The best reference on how children flourish and develop at a nursery is to speak to the parents of children who already attend. They can tell you how their children feel there, what they do, how they are coming on and how they themselves have found dealing and communicating with the staff. Does your wife go to any toddler groups where she could chat to someone whose child goes there?

I work at a school and the environemnt should be clean and hygienice but not to the degree where it appears almost sterile. Children learn best through play and as all parents know this can get messy. You dont want childrens playrooms or classrooms to be set up in a way that inhibits how they behave.

There are lots of really good resources that can be used to create stimulating displays. A good nursery will utilise these but that should be balanced with the childrens own work as well.

The nursery that my sons went to had displays on every wall and available surface. These were labelled in English and French. They had stuff hanging from the ceilings too. It was bright, colourful and looked like a Santas grotto of learning and imagination.

They had meals delivered each day by a catering company. All very healthy and nutritious but with no faff. The type of food you would serve at home. Children were encouraged to sit together at the table and to eat with good manners.

I felt like the nursery worked in harmony with the parents in the way they looked after the children. From what you write I would steer clear of this nursery which does appear to have its priorities wrong and out of sync with normal family life.

tyllwyd

You haven't said what type of an area you live in - is it an expensive area with lots of posh schools and nurseries, where they might feel they have to look posh to appeal to local parents? Are the fees higher than average?

marisco_2

A couple of further points is that nursery is the stepping stone to prepare children for their school days. Presenting food to the children as this nursery chooses to could backfire. Parents dont have the time, or understandably the inclination after a busy day at work, to mess about making dinner into animal faces etc. Likewise when these children start school their meals will be put on a plate in a normal fashion. Mstr 'Ive been to a posh nursery with a 5* chef' could struggle to sit down and polish off his bog standard school meal. However nice it may be.

Also if a child has never had their work acknowledged, appreciated and displayed it gives them no inclination to do their best. Children should be encouraged at every opportunity to reach their potential and given praise, not just when they achieve something, but in all the little steps they take to get there.

alinwales

An interesting balance of thoughts, thank you
(Though it doesn't make my life any easier!)

The nursery may be being kept tidy as they have had a few visits over the last few days from people from our previous nursery - that would be a plus, as our son would still have friends there - though means we need to jump soon as we know of at least one child who has just started there.

I will ask about the art/craft situation when I go there. Maybe the wife missed the kids' display, can always ask if not (and hope they don't say it's because the kids just paint sprawly painted pics and it goes against the amount of work they put in!) - we have his work on display at home.

The food thing is probably my biggest issue. Yay for fun food that they will eat of course, but our son happily eats anything and everything - so fancy food is more likely to introduce a problem? Time would tell of course. (I can imagine my wife going nuts at the suggestion that she should stick the chipolatas in the mashed potato to make it look like a sheep!)

As for other people's opinions of the new nursery - it is held in very high regard. As they're filling up fast, it's an obvious positive sign - though as there's not a huge amount of choice in the area then perhaps parents are just going with the default closest option, without really considering their child's needs... For instance, one mum was happy with the previous nursery, but then we showed her the folder that we had from our son when he left his first nursery (on site at mum's work before she left for maternity again). A world of difference which you can't comprehend if you don't have a comparison. (The other mum was stunned btw)

I could perhaps think that people could view the nusery as 'wow, we don't give that to our child at home, he will enjoy it here' .. rather than (in same vein as written by a previous poster) 'this is similar to what we give our child at home, so it balances well'.

On the plus side, all nurseries have to conform to developmental standards, and although this place hasn't had their first proper inspection yet (happens at 1yr), I would think from what I've heard that it will be rated highly for ticking all the necessary boxes, and probably extra for going beyond the call of duty.

Overall, it's probably something we will go with... though I'm glad I came here as it has given me the right sort of questions to ask. I'm not sure if they'd accept a formal 4week trial, as they have a £50 admin fee for joining (not a deposit!!). That's the only downside to be fair, as otherwise they're £1.50 a day more than we were paying before.

oh, cost: £39 a day for a fairly mixed area. The price is between the 37.50 we were paying at the other local nursery, and the £42 we would have been paying at my wife's work (in a city) had it not been subsidised.

Mojisola

alinwales wrote: »

On the plus side, all nurseries have to conform to developmental standards, and although this place hasn't had their first proper inspection yet (happens at 1yr), I would think from what I've heard that it will be rated highly for ticking all the necessary boxes, and probably extra for going beyond the call of duty.

It sounds as if you have a good measure in the previous nursery to check this one against. Have a long enough visit there to get a feel for what's going on.

The "ticking the boxes" inspections don't always give a good picture of what life is like on the ground. I've got the same problem at the other end of life. I'm looking round care homes to be prepared in case Dad wants to move into one. There are plenty which do well in the reports and look like 5* hotels with cordon bleu chefs but certainly don't feel like "home" and Dad wouldn't be comfortable there.

londonsurrey

Go for it. It could be the lovely place it promises to be.

Ask to spend time watching them. Watch for how they clear up (is it a seamless practised routine, or do the staff seem surprised and put out for doing it)

and whether the children are used to playing with the nice toys (I've known of nurseries where the "inspection" toys are lovely, and brought out of the locked cupboard, you guessed it, only for inspections!)

suki1001

Mojisola wrote: »

It sounds as if you have a good measure in the previous nursery to check this one against. Have a long enough visit there to get a feel for what's going on.

The "ticking the boxes" inspections don't always give a good picture of what life is like on the ground. I've got the same problem at the other end of life. I'm looking round care homes to be prepared in case Dad wants to move into one. There are plenty which do well in the reports and look like 5* hotels with cordon bleu chefs but certainly don't feel like "home" and Dad wouldn't be comfortable there.

How did the staff come across? I can also make the comparison with nursing homes. At the end of the day you can have an all singing all dancing one, but a place is only as good as it's staff. Working in several care homes gave me a very good insight that more expensive or rather fancier doesn't mean better. I would personally trust your instincts on this. If it feels good go for it - if the rigidity makes you feel like it's run by the Stepford wives look elsewhere.

I think there's a happy medium somewhere.