limited title guarantee

meg0210

My solicitor told me that the owner of the property that I am buying has died, so the title guarantee is " limited" . I have heard that there is no big difference between " limited" and "full", and in any case I cannot do anything in this regard. However, I am quite concerned that the executor has no personal knowledge about the property and may not provide much information that I am seeking, for example, the existence of (boundary) disputes with neighbours; the validity of the maintenance records of the central heating system and appliances; existence of gurantee/certificate for electric testing of installation and fittings, of guarantees for some works previously done, etc. If the executor cannot find that out for me, how will my purchase be affected ? Your advice will be highly appreciated.

anselld

This is normal for probate sales.
Either the records exist and you accept them at face value, or you make your own tests, inspections or enquiries. (which as you say is not that much different to normal).

cattie

As previous poster mentions, it's normal. I've just exchanged on a flat being sold by executors and no documentation and very little info has been provided. It's just a chance you take and you can arrange your own people to check such things as gas, electrics etc if you are concerned.

In my case the flat was being offered at around £20-£25k less than is usual on this very well kept development, so I had no qualms about buying it.

meg0210

Cattie, you are lucky. I made my offer on the assumption that I could get "normal" information from the vendors. Of course I can ask the tradespeople to do all the inspections and assume that no guarantee whatsoever exisits, but then i shall spend some hundreds more . I wonder if I could negotiate for a reduction of price for this reason!

cattie

It is always worth trying to negotiate, even if unsuccessful. I tried to get the place I'm buying at an even keener price. One of the executors is a very pompous sounding solicitor who has refused to furnish any information, just spouts that flat is sold as seen to requests from my solicitor.

Anyway, he refused to budge on price and whilst it was a bit painful not to be able to negotiate a deal, this being part of the fun of buying, I at least tried and I know that I have got the place at a pretty good price anyway, which will compensate me for any works that need to be carried out.

meg0210

Is it really a legal requirement for vendors of property to give the guarantees/certificates for electricity installation or gas appliance or heating system?Does it mean that if I have these guarantess or certificates I do not need to carry out the inspection? or does it mean that if the vendor cannot provide them (which is possibly so in my case) I shall do the inspections at my own cost and get those certificates/guarantees? At the end of the day, the question boils down to who has the responsibilites for proving that the property in question is gas/electricity safe for new occupiers.

cattie

The buyer has the responsibility to check out things like gas and electricity supplies and ch when buying a property. If a vendor has any certificates or guarantees then they would normally be handed over to solicitor as part of conveyancing process. But even then, it's no guarantee that everything is in absolutely A1 and 100% working condition, only that everything was fine at the time that certificates and guarantees were issued.

It shouldn't be a costly process to get utilities checked out, a boiler service can cost between £45-£75 depending on where you live and an electrician to check the supply doesn't need updating shouldn't cost much more.

You can do your own initial visual checks regarding electrics as if the consumer unit is an up to date one with circuit breaker, then the electrics are very unlikely to be in serious need of updating. It would be a different story if it has the old style fuse board, as then a rewire might be a possibility, but a new consumer unit to replace the old style fuse board would definitely be advisable.

When I moved into my current house there was not only an old style fuse board, but some very old circular round pin sockets in some rooms, so I knew straight away that a rewire was necessary.

meg0210

Thanks cattie. It means that I need to budget a few hundreds for all the checkings. I am still keen on having those certificates, as they prove that the installations are not DIY or done by some unqualified people. Do you think if I insist on having them the vendors shall ask for the inspection now?or I 'd better ask for a reduction of price (grouping these costs and some other repairs costs) ?

cattie

I think the problem you have is that you are buying the property from an executor, so it's very unlikely that they will be willing to get the services checked out prior to sale.

It shouldn't cost you several hundred pounds to get things checked out yourself, perhaps in the region of £150. Sometimes estate agents have people they know who can get services and such things checked, so always worth asking them.

Usually trying to renegotiate on an offer price is done when a surveyor has flagged up necessary work, so as I said before, it's always worth trying to negotiate the price down, but you have no guarantee that a vendor will agree to accept a lower price if they feel the issues you are basing a lower offer on are not really valid.

I would imagine you are a ftb by your anxiousness over not having certificates and guarantees? But the only real problem with not having certificates would be if the property had been recently rewired or had new windows fitted recently as certificates would have needed to have been obtained when those were done. Or if there has been some structural alteration done too the property. But if any of these things were done some years ago, then they would probably pre date the need for such certification.

Try not to throw too many unnecessary obstacles in the way of getting a property you want and worry too much about things that are not really that important.

It might help if you were able to give us an idea of what type of property you were buying, the age of it etc. as obviously an older property can have more problems or maintenance issues than a younger property.

meg0210

Cattie, you are right, I am a ftb, and so there are a lot of questions coming to my mind, when not much information is available from the vendor.
The property is built in the 1960s, and is an ex-council house. At the moment it is not occupied, so it is more difficult to ascertain whether the utilities are working or not, and worse than this is that the vendor are not living in the city where the property is located.
I cannot tell whether the wires or windows or pipeworks are recently fitted or not , but the surveyor does recommend a check- up and to get the certificates and guarantees.
As regard asking for a reduction, of course I am not asking for a reduction only for the inspection fees, but there is a major repair to be done to the garage (dampness due to leaking roof), so I think it may warrant the vendor's attention.
Anyway, thanks a lot for your advice. Buying/selling properties does take a lot of energy and LUCK.