UKPC parking charge!

debbieluv

I had a parking charge ticket on my car a few months back because i parked at some shops then i left the site to use the toilets across the road, when i came back i had a ticket on my car. It was asking me to pay £40 now or £90 in two weeks time. I didn't pay and instead i appealed to them in a letter explaining why i left the site.
They replied saying my appeal was unsuccessful and i now need to pay the £40 and they allowed another two weeks until it goes up to £90. Since then i have received two letters from them one as a reminder and another letter as a final reminder.
I have ignored all letters. I received a letter from debt recovery plus ltd since asking for £150 or it will commence to county courts! and still haven't replied.
Am I doing the right thing ignoring the letters or should I pay up? Please can someone give me some advice on what i should do?

I am unsure because i appealed i have admitted to being the driver and have admitted to leaving the site.

The_Slithy_Tove

You are doing the right thing. Just stay strong, and keep on ignoring.

Having identified yourself as the driver is just one teeny-weeny hurdle for UKPC to jump. There are many, many other obstacles in their way of legitimately getting money from you.

taffy056

You are doing the right thing, pretty soon you will have letters claiming to be solicitors then that will dry up. So for going to spend a penny it will soon cost you not a penny just read the sticky what to expect and you will see your letter chain there.

Stephen_Leak

I refuse to make any comment about UKPC taking the pi$$.

Firstly, the legal stuff.

Only councils, the police, train operators and Transport for London can impose legally enforceable fines or penalties. A private company or individual can't. A private parking company (PPC) call their tickets “Parking Charge Notices”, not “Penalty Charge Notices”. In law, they’re called “speculative invoices”.

Any warning signs are usually so badly positioned and worded, that they won’t have created a fair and legally binding deemed contract between the car park owner and a driver entering the car park in the first place. See The Unfair Contract Terms Act 1997 and Excel Parking Services vs. Cutts, Stockport, 2011.

All the car park owner (CPO) can claim from a driver in damages for any alleged breach of any alleged contract is what they’ve lost as a result. If it’s in a free car park or the driver paid, this is £0.00. Demanding more has been judged to be unreasonable and therefore an unfair contract penalty under the terms of The Unfair Contract Terms Act 1997, which is not legally enforceable. See Dunlop Pneumatic Tyre Co. Ltd. vs. New Garage & Motor Co. Ltd., House of Lords, 1914 and countless cases since.

There are also now recent landmark court cases, VCS Parking Control vs. Ronald Ibbotson, S!!!!horpe, 2012 (which also involved the victim leaving the site), HM Revenue & Customs vs. VCS Parking Control, Lower Tax Tribunal, 2012 and VCS Parking Control vs. HM Revenue & Customs (Appeal), Upper Tax Tribunal, 2012. In these cases, the judges ruled that only the car park owner can take drivers to court. The Upper Tax Tribunal is a court of record, equivalent to the High Court, and therefore its judgement sets a legal precedent.

What should I do now?

We don’t condone not paying or overstaying in a pay car park. If you owe the CPO the original charge, then you ought to write to the CPO, offering this in “full and final settlement”. In any event, you should write to the CPO, advising them that they are "jointly and severally liable" for the actions of their agents, the PPC, and that any further actions by either of them would be regarded as harassment under the terms of The Protection from Harassment Act 1997. This ought to make the CPO call off the PPC and, hopefully, realise the potential cost of doing business with a PPC.

Don’t appeal to the PPC. They always reject them. What’s in it for them to let anyone off? Actually, there is something in it for them: information. They need to know the identity of the driver of the vehicle involved at the time, because that’s who the alleged contract was with. If they don’t know who the driver was, they have to make do with harassing the registered keeper.

With windscreen notices, an appeal letter will tell them your name and address, and maybe who was driving at the time. If they don’t know who the driver was, they have to buy the details of registered keeper from the DVLA. With postal notices, they’ve had to do this already. But they still need to know the identity of the driver.

They sometimes say that they have the right to ask for this information. This doesn’t mean that you have to tell them.

However, even if you’ve written and told them who the driver was, it just means that they can now harass the driver instead of harassing the registered keeper.

How will they do this to me?

The PPC, then a debt collector and then a solicitor will send you a series of letters. The debt collector and solicitor are usually also the PPC, but using different headed paper. These letters will threaten you with every kind of financial and legal unpleasantness imaginable to intimidate you into paying.

The more unpleasant threats usually include mentioning that, if the case goes to court, a county court judgement (CCJ) will be issued, that bailiffs will be appointed and that your credit rating will be ruined. For things to actually get to this stage, the car park owner would have to take you to court and win the case. Then, you would have to refuse to pay, to get a CCJ issued after 28 days. Then, you would have to still refuse to pay, to get bailiffs appointed.

But, they can't actually do anything, for the same reason that a blackmailer can't take anyone who didn’t pay them to court.

What should I do then?

Continue to ignore everything you get from the PPC and their aliases. It does seem odd to deal with something like this by ignoring it. Eventually, they will run out of empty threats and stop throwing good money after bad.

Kite2010

The landowner most likely suffered no losses for the driver of your vehicle parking in that car-park and you going over the road to use the loo.

Ignore UKPC, unless in the unlikely event you receive genuine court-papers

Oopsadaisy

Words 5 & 6 = parking charge = private = ignore.

debbieluv

Thank you for reassuring me. I will carry on ignoring them.

debbieluv

I have received another letter saying NOTICE OF LITIGATION. They are basically threatening me with CCJ's. Will they send me to court? I am scared they might. Any advice? or should i still just ignore?

taffy056

debbieluv wrote: »

I have received another letter saying NOTICE OF LITIGATION. They are basically threatening me with CCJ's. Will they send me to court? I am scared they might. Any advice? or should i still just ignore?

Yes plenty of advice, coincidently you received it above, just ignore them as they don't do court

Kite2010

To get a CCJ the following needs to happen:
1 - They follow up their threats and take you to court
2 - They win in court
3 - You refuse to pay what the judge orders within 28 days.

1 is unlikely, there has been a PPC issuing court papers but either doing no-shows on the day of the court case or redrawing from proceeding once a defence has been entered

2 - With a good defence, you will probably win

ManxRed

UKPC have NEVER been in court.

No, I lie, they did once, and they were the defendants!

Relax.