MSE News: Santander to charge for 'free' business accounts

JuicyJesus

While I don't have much truck with Santander, it is within their T&Cs that they can change pricing or T&Cs at will given sufficient notice. Legally speaking, you don't really have a leg to stand on.

http://www.santander.co.uk/csgs/StaticBS?blobcol=urldata&blobheader=application%2Fpdf&blobkey=id&blobtable=MungoBlobs&blobwhere=1223424244028&cachecontrol=immediate&ssbinary=true&maxage=3600 . See clause 16. You are of course free to switch your banking elsewhere should you wish to do so.

How recently were they offering "free business banking forever"? Was that ever actually a contractual term, that they would never ever charge for business banking?

BusinessIsBusiness

Firstly I would like to say, it is awful how those who are being moved have been treated in this migration.

In terms of switching bank accounts- it is easy... once you open another you can use the new banks switching service to move all regular payments across. Then all you need to do is transfer the balance, tell customers the new details and close the old one.

From a legal perspective, I am sure Santander has passed this through the legal department with a fine tooth comb in terms of the legalities surrounding such a change. As I understand it, the promise was made by other businesses that the bank acquired and supposedly you as customers had to accept new terms when Santander acquired the banks. This means that they can effectively change the service they provide to you any way they wish. Giving you notice means basically you can like it or lump it and go elsewhere. So any original paperwork won’t mean much in court- the new t&cs’s supersede any original paperwork you have from the old banks.

From the evidence of this thread you can see why they have done this. People either not using the account very regularly or use it as a secondary account don’t make the bank money. Even as a main account it doesn’t make the bank any money. So it just seems like an unscrupulous way of weeding out those that aren’t making the bank anything. As I say its not very nice, and couldn’t come at a worse time!! But you have to ask what has happened to the banks that did offer it and also look at what other banks offer free banking? HSBC might be free under certain limits, but its still not free.. they will catch you out.

Please don’t take it out on those on the phones. They are only dealing with the decisions of higher management. Looking at the MD of Business Bankings LinkedIn page it appears he needs to grow the revenue of Business Banking to £350m by year 3 starting last year, so that is probably why this is happening.

BusinessIsBusiness

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Paulgonnabedebtfree

BusinessIsBusiness wrote: »

Firstly I would like to say, it is awful how those who are being moved have been treated in this migration (not everyone is affected... yet!). The reason the date of the migration is ambiguous is because Santander don’t know themselves the precise date when the switch will occur- it certainly won’t be before the 60 days notice period and is unlikely to be before November.

In terms of switching bank accounts- it is easy... once you open another you can use the new banks switching service to move all regular payments across. Then all you need to do is transfer the balance, tell customers the new details and close the old one.

From a legal perspective, I am sure Santander has passed this through the legal department with a fine tooth comb in terms of the legalities surrounding such a change. As I understand it, the promise was made by other businesses that the bank acquired and supposedly you as customers had to accept new terms when Santander acquired the banks. This means that they can effectively change the service they provide to you any way they wish. Giving you notice means basically you can like it or lump it and go elsewhere. So any original paperwork won’t mean much in court- the new t&cs’s supersede any original paperwork you have from the old banks.

From the evidence of this thread you can see why they have done this. People either not using the account very regularly or use it as a secondary account don’t make the bank money. Even as a main account it doesn’t make the bank any money. So it just seems like an unscrupulous way of weeding out those that aren’t making the bank anything. As I say its not very nice, and couldn’t come at a worse time!! But you have to ask what has happened to the banks that did offer it and also look at what other banks offer free banking? HSBC might be free under certain limits, but its still not free.. they will catch you out.

Please don’t take it out on those on the phones. They are only the minions dealing with the decisions of higher management. Looking at the MD of Business Bankings LinkedIn page it appears he needs to grow the revenue of Business Banking to £350m by year 3 starting last year, so that is probably why this is happening.

Getting about 150 customers to switch their bill payments to another bank isn't trivial. It was hard enough to get some of them to pay by BACS in the first place. Most only agreed grudgingly when it looked like cheques were going to be abolished in the next few years. Santander shot themselves in the foot with that one as well though. Due to never displaying the reference numbers on BACS payments, I opened a business account elsewhere and switched all the BACS payments already (except for two which I will sort out soon).. So the other bank receives all my BACS payments. Santander receive all my cash and cheques via their ATM (I live near a branch). So due to their incompetence, they already only receive my "expensive" transactions.
Although I do get your meanings, I do disagree with you about some stuff (not surprising, eh?) . When Santander took over the business from Abbey, they should have gone through all the potential costs/liabilities etc with their well used tooth comb. Indeed, it took them until about a year ago to remove the free business banking for new customers.
My other concern (not yet mentioned) is that if Santander get away with this, £7.50 a month is only the start. Don't believe me? Look what they did with authorised overdraft charges on personal accounts.

On another tack, something that has been muted re basnking is a "for life" account number where transactions can be forwarded to the current bank of choice. Now THAT would be a help. Would save a lot of problems with incoming BACS payments if a banker change was needed.

EDIT: They say it costs about £1 to process a cheque. No charges for individual cheques on personal accounts? Let's see now. My personal account to my business account - the sum of one penny. If others want to play with the letter of the law, so can I.

DruidDonagh

Good evening to all,

After hearing and reading all of this, I have been looking into this and looking at the T&C which where provided with the original account.
In paragraph 16 (on page 18) it is stated that the T&C can change provided they give sufficient notice.

It has come to my attention that the letters send out is nothing more than a heads up about the changes which seem to be due in November. I do understand that there will be a second letter providing the 60 days notice as conform the current T&C.

In addition I can confirm that the local Abby (now Santander) stopped promoting the Free business accounts for roughly 1,5 years.

cashisking1

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Paulgonnabedebtfree

cashisking1 wrote: »

You know what? I have heard enough of the 'we're all doomed' talk on here.
It is Private Fraser all over again (Dads Army for those young 'uns).
I have great tenacity and have had success many times before when the odds have been well stacked against me and may I add, my law studies have taught me that 'argument is the life blood of the law'.
It is important to keep fighting as long as you keep perspective, focused and reasonable.
I won't lose any sleep whatever the outcome, but things should be fair and free forever should mean free forever, otherwise why say or write it?
The law is their to protect us and we should use it.
Please forgive the rant and the best of luck.

Exactly. If it wasn't meant to be "free forever", it should have just been called "free".
I have given this a lot of thought today - more thought than it deserves really. I have decided that I will be fighting this to the bitter end. However, today I have felt bad and I can attribute it almost wholly to the feelings invoked within me when I read Santander's letter. I can fight this WITHOUT feeling bad about it. In fact, I can fight it more effectively if I don't let emotion rule. Fortunately, over the years, I have taught myself to be my own psychologist and look inward when I'm not feeling so good. There lies my answer. The first few times I was ever lied to and let down were very big lies and very big let downs. That tends to amplify later lies and let downs. Santander don't have the power over me that the first liars had. In spite of that, if I end up paying for this "free forever" service, I swear that I will ensure that it costs them many times what it costs me. But I can now do it with a smile on my face and a song in my heart.
Also, I'm trying not to attach any importance to the fact that the two posters who seem to favour or be neutral about Santander's stance are very new posters. It does cause me to wonder if any allegiance exists between the posters and the company in such a situation. Probably not but I've seen stranger things on internet forums.

cashisking1

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smallbusinessmum1

Hi all, Im in the same position. Two business accounts with the charges letter arriving yesterday. I have written a complaint letter to Santander as they were happy to take us on as Abbey customers and run the account for years with the terms we signed upto many years ago.

I have suggested that its new customers who should have the new terms imposed.

I am hoping if enough people complain they consider the PR gaff, (Even if you phone to complain - you should write too or it might not be followed up - as was my previous experience on the Santander ISA dept.) although as the bank takes over more and there is less choice I dont suppose we will be heard.

I will then pass the complaint onto the Ombusdsman should my account not stay the same as it is now.

zcaprd7

Susievintage wrote: »

I have found my Abbey paperwork, and it states very clearly that it is free business banking forever, within certain transaction limits - nowhere is that magic clause about being able to change T&Cs whenever they want.

So I have phoned the FSA, and here is what we do:

1. Phone the FSA (0845 606 1234) to log your complaint as well - they will get a good idea of the scale of the problem
2. Complete their online complaint form about misleading financial promotions - http://www.fsa.gov.uk/pages/doing/regulated/promo/report/form.shtml
3. Email your complaint to Richard Harris at customer.services@abbey com. (This is the contact given on the FSA Register.) State that it is an "official complaint". Explain what redress or resolution you are seeking - for me, it's free business banking forever as promised.
4. Give him 8 weeks to reply - this is allowed by law.
5. If you're happy with his response, open the champers (or Tizer).
6. If you're not happy, escalate it to the Financial Ombudsman - they can do nothing until you have done steps 3 and 4.

I'll be doing all this later today - the more of us who contact Mr Harris, the better.

Agreed, I know its cheeky, but can you stick up your templates (or some text) to make it a bit easier for others in your wake please!