Preparedness for when

pineapple

This has probably been mentioned before and I guess many here are already on it - but I suppose it doesn't do any harm to bump ...
This is an active forum with a ton of useful info. Membership is largely the UK and they even have meet ups. You have to register to see it all though!
http://www.p2s-prepared2survive.co.uk/

pineapple

BessieBooBoo wrote: »

Lesson, er, 6 I think, record what you have so you aren't scrambling around in cupboards, etc., wondering whats there.

However it can come as a nice surprise as in OMG I didn't realise I had that!
Not so good though when one has just gone out and bought X more of the same :mad:

[Deleted User]

PINEAPPLE you are spot on when you say we could do so much more by working together as a community and I think it would happen amongst like minded people. The problem would be those who opted out of community activities but expected a share of any produce or services and just took what they wanted. I'm sure it would be sortoutable but difficult to sort out peacefully.

CRAIGY - The mental picture you create in your Prince of Belfast post is one I shall treasure for a long time. Did you win the wrestling match or did glow in the dark bunny come for walkies too?

Take care all, Cheers Lyn xxx.

katieclampet

westcoastscot wrote: »

GQ yes lots of us would perish - I guess the population would lessen fairly quickly.
Ginny I think you have it there - strength in numbers and inter-generational living is the way forward, both SHTF-wise and to see us through these times. I live with two of my grown-up children and they often provide the muscle-power to allow me to continue to garden, cut wood etc. I think we'll see a lot more inter-generational households and they have lots of benefits.

I read an interesting EOTWAWKI book a year or so ago, I think the scenerio was an EMP hit the earth, and we lost all electricity. Ths story was set in America (of course), in an isolated area. The main charachter was a prepper, and of course had food, water, guns, etc, and also seeds, to start planting and crops.

One thing that he talked about (to his family) was how in a SHTF scenerio, people would come in waves. After a couple of days, the 1st wave of people would start moving, looking for food, water, medical care and some sort of organized authority.

This would last for a few weeks, then it would tail off, then after a few months those people who had bunkered in at home, and lived off there stores would run out, and they would start migrating.

He wasnt going to plant any of his crops until a year after the disaster, because it would be a signal that people were living there, and invite interest.

It was quite interesting and went into a lot of detail about using OS skills to farm, build, provide heating and such like. Unfortunately it all went pear shaped when the bad guys on bikes turned up!

I suppose it made me think that it doesnt matter how OS and well you are doing in an extreme SHTF scenerio, in the wrong circumstances the bad guys could take it all anyway. So there would definitely be safety in numbers, and in having strong links with the local community
katie

grandma247

This one should work. Just click projects on the side. just tried it and it worked.not sure why the other didn't.

2tonsils

Well after a very relaxing Christmas in Northern Greece wandering around a lake in the sunshine, then a nice New year letting in Greek then British new year with a gang of friends in fancy dress I am almost back to normality now lol. I thought things had been very quiet over the holidays and I must say I enjoyed the break from worrying if the S would HTF anytime soon.

However, things seem to be hotting up a bit today. Here is the news from the last few hours...

Crete has had 12 minor earthquakes today, the biggest being 4.5 and its still shaking.

Stromboli volcano in Italy has been shaking for a few days and is now starting to erupt again with violent explosions of very liquid lava that is spraying over nearby villages.

1.5 million people have been told to evacuate a city in Iran immediately. Only 'pollution at emergency levels' is mentioned but most sources seem to think there is a radioactive leak/explosion at the nearby Nuclear facility.

The Greek government have just published the following figures:

Tax from heating oil revenue increases have dropped by 400 million euros as no one can afford to buy it. Pollution is at dangerous levels in Athens due to all the wood fires being relit so the government is planning to add tax to fire wood.

Tax from increased alcohol duty has resulted in a drop of 70 percent in alcohol sales and consumption.

Road tax, which is due this week has been increased and as a result 25 percent have taken their car off the roads and returned the plates to the tax office. Another 25 percent cannot pay the tax and are expected to pay very late (100 percent fine added) or to return the plates.

The government are adding FIVE extra property taxes to the January electric bill and the price of electric is going up by 45 percent as well. The electric board now have almost fifty percent of customers who cannot pay and are cut off.

No one will get a tax allowance this year so you will pay tax from the first euro income. Pensioners and people who earn only 5000 euros a year will also be taxed.

Blimey, happy new year to all politicians! Stocked up on food again today and bought lots of offers that were on. I might need a couple of months of non spending just to pay my January taxes.....

BessieBooBoo

2tonsils wrote: »

Well after a very relaxing Christmas in Northern Greece wandering around a lake in the sunshine, then a nice New year letting in Greek then British new year with a gang of friends in fancy dress I am almost back to normality now lol. I thought things had been very quiet over the holidays and I must say I enjoyed the break from worrying if the S would HTF anytime soon.

However, things seem to be hotting up a bit today. Here is the news from the last few hours...

Crete has had 12 minor earthquakes today, the biggest being 4.5 and its still shaking.

Stromboli volcano in Italy has been shaking for a few days and is now starting to erupt again with violent explosions of very liquid lava that is spraying over nearby villages.

1.5 million people have been told to evacuate a city in Iran immediately. Only 'pollution at emergency levels' is mentioned but most sources seem to think there is a radioactive leak/explosion at the nearby Nuclear facility.

The Greek government have just published the following figures:

Tax from heating oil revenue increases have dropped by 400 million euros as no one can afford to buy it. Pollution is at dangerous levels in Athens due to all the wood fires being relit so the government is planning to add tax to fire wood.

Tax from increased alcohol duty has resulted in a drop of 70 percent in alcohol sales and consumption.

Road tax, which is due this week has been increased and as a result 25 percent have taken their car off the roads and returned the plates to the tax office. Another 25 percent cannot pay the tax and are expected to pay very late (100 percent fine added) or to return the plates.

The government are adding FIVE extra property taxes to the January electric bill and the price of electric is going up by 45 percent as well. The electric board now have almost fifty percent of customers who cannot pay and are cut off.

No one will get a tax allowance this year so you will pay tax from the first euro income. Pensioners and people who earn only 5000 euros a year will also be taxed.

Blimey, happy new year to all politicians! Stocked up on food again today and bought lots of offers that were on. I might need a couple of months of non spending just to pay my January taxes.....

Hello 2T

Yikes! Please keep safe and warm... That's horrendous.

I remember a lady on the news who spoke eloquently about the situation re the Greek government "...they are trying to skin us fleas for the little we have, and it's still not enough..."

I have the pessimistic feeling it will come here to the UK; our gov. is cutting over a longer period, i.e. next 5 years or so, cut after cut, and the only things left to cut where I worked (public service) were staff hours or staff themselves.

The view of our gov. that private sector would swallow up public sector redundancies isn't happening, some staff retired as they felt they couldn't cope with being asked to do more work, on the same hours, without a pay rise for the last 3 years, and no pay rises on the horizon. They were being sounded out for taking unpaid holidays, less and less employee rights, and 'Doing more with less'.

And other things being considered such as bedroom tax, LA's funding being cut for things like elderly care, children's services, even our local GP was lecturing my mum on how expensive her meds are, even though she needs them!

All seemingly little things, but, the bottom line is, UK is in huge debt, scrambling around trying to save money from the most vulnerable, yet still in deep do-do.

Chameleon, we are not "all in this together" when the weakest and most vulnerable are being left to fend for themselves, whilst millionaire MP's, and fat cat bankers, sit congratulating themselves that they are saving the economy i.e. business....

(Climbs off soapbox)

Still, I am scrambling to prep for the worst and hope for the best, it's all we can do, look after ourselves, family, neighbours, friends as best we can....

BBB

mardatha

Right On Sister! lol :T:T:T

RAS

Picking up on a few comments here

mardatha wrote: »

But the point of this post is, he thinks the UK is very bad for survivalists. too many people too little land etc. And when I say there's tons and tons of empty land up here around me, he says yes its empty because nothing will grow on it and nobody can live on it. Which I suppose is true ..............
I read his emails then I go into the preppers sites and read all their garbage about running for the hills, defending their homes, buying guns and making weapons and I just want to whack them wi the laptop for living in cloud cuckoo land………………………….
I sort of feel like the people at the very start of WW2 - when you read their diaries they were thinking all sorts of things and muddling around doing bits & pieces that were mainly useless.

Mar
Your particular patch of ground is amongst the most challenging in the UK; just about the only thing harder is the Cairngorm plateau. Do not know what bright spark thought putting housing there was a good idea but………
It is a damn sight easier to grow well in the north west than on your ridge ………. with a few provisos.

westcoastscot wrote: »

Mar and Mary I agree with both your posts - it's really hard to make a living up here, it's a skill that evolves over time, and certainly when I lived on the island life was physically challenging but fantastic. Since moving to the mainland i've realised just how different our life was - lots of day to day choices just weren't there - we had to eat seasonally, manage when crops failed, croft/hunt/fish our protein and make do and mend/barter skills as there wasn't anywhere to purchase stuff at a price we could afford, including skills.
...........and what I wanted to say was that it wouldn't work to "head for the hills" in a SHTF situation - most folks wouldn't last 2 minutes as the day to day work involved is huge and needs a total change in mindset and every member of the family needs to work productively in some way.

WCS – you have done it; I only came very close 20 years ago. I would not contemplate it now. At this point I think a lot of islands and some areas of the western seaboard have got to the stage where the many of the remaining communities are too small to be viable longer term, which is a huge pity; with more people it would be possible to support more services which could make life easier for everyone.

There remain some fundamental problems in many places in the Highlands as a result of the Clearances and other issues; people removed from the better land which was given over to sheep or deer and has deteriorated ever since, historical over-population of the poorest areas and the limited tree cover throughout the area.

When I compare what people can grow in the furthest parts of Norway, or even the Western fjords with what is grown in the Highlands I despair. The ownership of large tracts by private or conservation landowners; the difficulty protecting common land; the difficulties created by the deliberate decision to limit croft sizes to ensure men had to work outside to provide a workforce; and tree-cover or lack of tree cover all limit productivity.

The road to Damascus for me runs from Kinloch Resort to Hamnavay. That is when I realised that all these treeless lands were capable of supporting really large trees, if you could keep the sheep and deer off them. In another location, I enthused about the potential of a large gently south-facing loch-side, suggesting to the conservation bod that I would love to see people return to the cleared clachans. Apart from the fact that the LL would never agree to this, he was rather less than keen to see people replace the deer there!

Elsewhere I knew people who could grow stuff, but struggled to find people to buy it because of the limited number of outlets and centralised distribution.

If we could wrinkle that land from out under the current holders, it could support a lot more people than currently. Not that I see it happening, ‘cos it wilderness in’t it?

I agree that a lot of people would really struggle with the realities not so much of the portfolio career necessary in those areas but the portfolio of skills required in isolated communities. The stark fact is that a lot of people I encounter in the city would struggle with the portfolio of skills needed to produce or maintain any of the food or equipment they use day in day out; I am trying to work on that as best as I can but it is hard not to be seen as a white middle class parachute.

maryb wrote: »

But when it really mattered in WWII people got their act together, didn't they? Prepping gets you through the critical stage and then we somehow have to find collective solutions, because I think your friend is right, there's not much point being a survivalist here in the UK.

Prior to WW11 some barmy souls spent a lot of time thinking about how they might survive if things went pear-shaped. Given the social niceties of the time when things hit the fan and some chum of the minister turned up and said he and his mates had been working on a rationing scheme for three years, they were put in charge of implementing it, for example. So preppers have their uses; just cosying up to the powers that be might be useful as well.

GreyQueen

vanoonoo wrote: »

did I ever mention, when my husband and I part ways, I always say to him: be good, be safe, be careful

I think that may be my sig for 2013

My departing line is: if you can't be good, be careful!

:beer:Belated happy birthday, Noo. Glad you enjoyed your day out.

katieclampet, very true about waves of refugees. John Wesley Rawles' book TEOTWAWKI has some useful stuff in it about "lines of drift" such as routes which refugees from cities in trouble would take. He rehearses what would probably happen if Joe Sixpack, the archetypal American man, hit a SHTF situation. He posits that lines of travel leading away from metroplitan areas into rural ones would become major throughfares of refugees.

Some people would head into their nearest boonies, perhaps an area of land used for recreation such as a national park and hope to hunker down in a holiday cabin. Others might think to head towards fertile land in a gentle climate, and that these areas would quickly become a mass of brawling, desperate humanity.

I've had it pointed out that in the era that we are in now, there is no such thing as a completely secret location. If a road leads anywhere, someone will travel along it eventually. The communitites which might stand the best chances of avoiding a refugee influx would be those who lived in places where the topography meant that there were easily-controlled access points such as a few bridges over impassable terrain.

People have also hid out sucessfully in boggy areas in troubled times, particularly if they have local knowledge of the byways and marshes and access to something with a shallow draft like a punt or a kayak. I've kayaked along coastal areas and have been impressed at how agile a 2 person sea kayak is, and how easlily you can get it into river systems. I've even sailed with them with nothing more than the paddles and a square of ripstop nylon as a sail and it's freaking fast and a bit hairy.

You might, when the SHTF, want to hide from other people for fear of attack or fear of them spreading communicable diseases into your family or wider community. Or because they were actually zombies.:p

*****************

I've often pondered on the craziness of life where people who need large homes and gardens, such as those with growing families, cannot afford them. Then, you sometimes end up in your latter years with a home far larger than you need and a garden you possibly cannot manage due to infirmity.

People being able to pod-off into homes of their own or just them and their chidren is a relatively-new phenomena in the West and has no currency in a lot of parts of the world even today. People in some of the least developed parts of the world are incredulous and horrified at the mere idea of the old peoples home or that parents put babies and children to sleep in their own rooms. They consider such practices barbarous.

It may be that we'll have different expectations in the decades and generations to come and that we cluster into multi-generational homes to share the resources and provide company for each other.

Be interesting to watch how things pan out.

2tonsils pretty darned worrying about the things in your post, inc my beloved Crete. I once listened to a documentary about another volcano, Vesuvius. They pointed out that there is no possible way for Naples to evacute if V blows, even using a combination of road and sea routes. And that due to abuse of planning regs, homes have been built up the flanks of V which would be in the path of lava or an even deadlier pyroclastic flow. One of those things that you sincerely hope never happens.

And ain't it typical to respond to the abandonment of heating oil for wood leading to smog by taxing the wood. They'll beggar everyone at that rate.