Energy meter reader trespass??

uk1

Terrylw1 wrote: »

But since the t&c's include you giving "reasonable" access, what is classes as reasonable?

The supplier is going to use that t&c against you so it would need something in the Tort to overrule it. This would effectively make the clause illegal in the contracts.

In fact the term is fine unless it is used unreasonably. It then falls to the Unfair Contract Terms Act 1977.

If for example it were used in the way that some of the posters here believe and the consumer feels that the vagueness of the use reasonable had been unfairly abused then he could take action. Much of the rubbish spouted here needn't go that far because a householder should simply call the police as a crime would have been commited.

Reasonable means that a request is made - by appointment if neccessary - and the consumer agrees. No terms that contravene the "right to privacy" which is the main purpose of Section 8 of the Human Rights Act are legally valid. This is a !qualified right" and prevents all authorities: "and they should not enter without your permission. This applies whether or not you own your home." This effectively covers you day to day except if a crime has been commited when the police or other authorities can only enter with a warrant. It is in pursuit of compliance with the Act that magistrates need a signed statement for them to consider warrants from the police or others and any false statements are considered perjury.

This is considered the specific lawful process for these companies:

Gas and Electricity Suppliers


[FONT=Georgia, Times, Serif]An official of a gas or electricity company may enter your home if :[/FONT]



[FONT=Georgia, Times, Serif][/FONT]
[FONT=Georgia, Times, Serif]

• You agree to let the official enter.
• A magistrate has given the official a warrant authorising the official to enter.
• There is an emergency and the official has reason to believe that there is danger to life or property .

A gas or electricity board official is entitled to ask to enter your home, or to apply to a magistrate for a warrant, in order to :[/FONT][FONT=Georgia, Times, Serif]

• Inspect, substitute, re-install a meter (including a pre-payment meter).
• Add, alter or repair supply lines or pipes and other fittings.
• Remove from a pre-payment meter money or tokens belonging to the supplier.
• Inspect any other fittings.
• Disconnect the supply or remove a meter or other fittings in certain circumstances.

In order to obtain a warrant, the official must show that :[/FONT][FONT=Georgia, Times, Serif]

• You have been given at least twenty-four hours' notice (except in certain circumstances where at least 2 or 5 days or up to a week may be required ); and
• He or she has asked to be admitted and you have refused; or
• The premises are unoccupied.

Entry must be at a reasonable time and the official must leave the house as secure against trespassers as it was when he or she arrived , and make good any damage caused .[/FONT]
[FONT=Georgia, Times, Serif]It is a criminal offence intentionally to obstruct a person who has a warrant or who asks to be admitted in an emergency ; the maximum penalty is a fine on level 3 (currently £1000). It is not an offence to refuse to let the official enter if there is no emergency and the official does not have a warrant.[/FONT]

[FONT=Georgia, Times, Serif]The law governing those powers of entry is to be found in[/FONT]




[FONT=Georgia, Times, Serif][/FONT]
[FONT=Georgia, Times, Serif]

• the Rights of Entry (Gas and Electricity Boards) Act 1954;
• Schedule 2B of the Gas Act 1986 (inserted by the Gas Act 1995) which sets out the “Gas Code”)
• Schedule 6 of the Electricity Act 1989, which sets out the “Electricity Code”)

[/FONT]

With respect to CCTV - as I said before the Data Protection Act does not apply to CCTV at private properties.

The introduction of the Data Protection Act means that most CCTV installations designed to provide either crime prevention, crime detection or to enhance the safety of the public will now have to comply with the requirements of the Act. The Act applies to commercial and public CCTV systems only, so if your system is for your own private residence you do not need to comply with it.

It's a shame that this thread shows that some of these employees are completely clueless. It has all also gone to prove that a little knowledge is a dangerous thing and these people seem to be masters of spouting complete rubbish based on the abuse of several different sensible laws and acts. This ignorance is further enhanced by an extraordinarily poor attitude toward their fellow citizens and customers demonstrated by some of them here.

I have also changed my mind on one aspect as a result of what these people have consistently spouted. I now believe they are encouraged to break the law by their employers. That would explain much, and if so then in a way these employees are also (almost) as much victims as we are. They are basically probably being encouraged to break the law and placing themselves in danger. I think they are simply often employing the wrong type of people and encouraging them by both the method of pay and by instruction to do the wrong things.

I really hope that these companies start to think about this more and train these people properly before one of them gets seriously hurt.

chanz4

Jamie_Carter wrote: »

And to do that they have to obtain a warrant. And the police would be there to execute the warrant. The meter readers have no power of entry.

If a cannabis farm is suspected, then again, the police willexecute the warrant. Not the meter readers.

I do it as my daily job, the police do not have to be there. The police will attend if its a confirmed farm or breach of the peace.

Warrants for tamper and rights of meter inspection are separate type of warrants. I don't think you understand how it works.

I never said fake statements, however if their is reasonable doubt as to the reason for you refusing access or suspicion of tamper, It can be processed and will be. When a reader sends a flow, it sends a mp2 stating suspected theft everyone of these must be acted ons.

chanz4

as you seem bored, read this http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1989/29/schedule/6

uk1

chanz4 wrote: »

I never said fake statements, however if their is reasonable doubt as to the reason for you refusing access or suspicion of tamper, It can be processed and will be.

That's exactly what you said.

chanz4 wrote: »

if you are obstructive they could always put suspected tamper code through on their handheld. The rpu will have great pleasure in breaking in and no notice is required.

Anyway - you clearly know it all.

chanz4

(1)The M1Rights of Entry (Gas and Electricity Boards) Act 1954 (entry under a justice’s warrant) shall apply in relation to the powers of entry conferred by this Schedule.E+W+S
(2)Any reference in this Schedule to an officer or other person authorised by an electricity supplier or an electricity distributor includes a reference to a person who, in accordance with a written authority given by the supplier or distributor to an agent of the supplier or distributor, is authorised by the agent on behalf of the supplier or distributor.

(3)Where in pursuance of any power of entry conferred by this Schedule, entry is made on any premises by a person authorised to do so—

(a)that person shall ensure that the premises are left no less secure by reason of the entry; and

(b)the supplier or distributor shall make good, or pay compensation for, any damage caused by that person (or by any other person accompanying him under sub-paragraph (5)) in entering the premises, in taking any action on the premises or in making them secure.

(4)A person may only exercise a power of entry conferred by this Schedule on production of some duly authenticated document showing his authority.

(5)Any person exercising a power of entry conferred by this Schedule may be accompanied by such other persons as may be necessary or expedient for the purpose for which the entry is made or for the purposes of sub-paragraph (3)(a) or (b) above.

(6)A person who intentionally obstructs a person exercising powers of entry conferred by this Schedule shall be liable on summary conviction to a fine not exceeding level 3 on the standard scale.

uk1

And your point is what exactly? You have to get THE WARRANT! You are clearly having a comprehension failure.

chanz4

uk1 wrote: »

That's exactly what you said.




Anyway - you clearly know it all.

But the rpu would be acting on information received, so cant be classed as lying. People who are not hiding something don't normaly block access to meters that are outside.

chanz4

uk1 wrote: »

And your point is what exactly? You have to get THE WARRANT! You are clearly having a comprehension failure.

And that's not hard, most are seen by court clerks. A supplier has a right to inspect its equipment

Inspectorman

NeverEnough wrote: »

And lying to magistrates to obtain warrants would end in a custodial sentence - we always allow meter readers access by appointment, it is not reasonable to expect householders to bow and scrape to the whim of these nasty little creeps. And the utility companies themselves tell householders who are uncertain of the identity of the meter reader (could be a bogus one ) to deny access or to check on their identity - not always feasible on the spot - and a female householder would be quite within her rights if she were alone at home, to refuse a surprise demand for entry from some arrogant demanding threatening fool and ask for this to be done by appointment when her safety could be assured by having someone else with her at the time.

Creeps and arrogant? Nice of you to tar everyone with the same brush there. I'm sorry you yourself appear to have had a bad experience with meter readers but they aren't all the same (as in all lines of work) - when I use to do the job, I like to think I did it in a courteous and professional manner.

uk1

Inspectorman wrote: »

Creeps and arrogant? Nice of you to tar everyone with the same brush there. I'm sorry you yourself appear to have had a bad experience with meter readers but they aren't all the same (as in all lines of work) - when I use to do the job, I like to think I did it in a courteous and professional manner.

Out of curiosity - as someone who clearly cares about the job and reputation - what comments and observations do you have on the posters here purporting to be meter readers?