UKCPS Parking Ticket, Wrong Reg!

shan7-8-6

Hey everybody,

I got a parking ticket from these UKCPS (!!!!!) the other day, and I was going to pay it today, put the issue number etc in, and guess what, they got my numberplate completely wrong (they missed 1 number out and got a letter wrong lol). Would I still have to pay it? Its my dads car and I wouldn't want him getting a penalty charge notice, since he'd say pay it, plus already on bad terms at the moment!

Look forward to your responses

SodG24

A) It's not a parking ticket or a penalty charge

The normal advice as per the thousands of other posts - IGNORE.

fivetide

As above, no need to pay and if they don't have the right reg they might not even send the letters.

Worth noting it to your dad though because if they took pics and use that to get the registered owners details he is in line for a lot of threatening letters!

Bring him here for reassurance!

5t.

ManxRed

You wouldn't have to pay it even if they'd got your number right! Its a fake parking ticket with no legal obligation to pay it.

However...

The scary begging letters will probably end up being sent to someone else (if the incorrect number plate exists). BUT... should they discover their error and correct the number plate (e.g. if they took a photo and decided to refer back to it) then your Dad MIGHT end up getting the begging letters.

Just be aware of this slim possibility.

If it does happen, you would need to try and convince him that he is not liable for any charge, and neither are you, and that the correct advice is to simply ignore it, and ignore all the scary letters. The threats in the letters will not ever materialise, they are there simply to scare you/your Dad into paying up without questioning the legality of the charge.

Coupon-mad

shan7-8-6 wrote: »

Hey everybody,

I got a parking ticket from these UKCPS (!!!!!) the other day, and I was going to pay it today, put the issue number etc in, and guess what, they got my numberplate completely wrong (they missed 1 number out and got a letter wrong lol). Would I still have to pay it? Its my dads car and I wouldn't want him getting a penalty charge notice, since he'd say pay it, plus already on bad terms at the moment!

Look forward to your responses

Don't even think about it!!!!!!!

And if your Dad doesn't know that fake PCNs are a well known scam then show him this info:


- You may not get any as they got the reg wrong, but if you do, just play snap by ticking off the threatening letters Here.

- Watchdog clip with expert Solicitor's opinion here.

- Barrister's opinion here.


Show your family and friends, don't hide this, it's a scam that everyone should know about! Spread the word like we do.

Only take seriously a real ticket from the Police, TFL, Council or (rarely) a real penalty from a Train Operator.

Anything else is destined for 'shredding for hamster-bedding'.

HTH

fivetide

ManxRed wrote: »

You wouldn't have to pay it even if they'd got your number right! Its a fake parking ticket with no legal obligation to pay it.

However...

The scary begging letters will probably end up being sent to someone else (if the incorrect number plate exists). BUT... should they discover their error and correct the number plate (e.g. if they took a photo and decided to refer back to it) then your Dad MIGHT end up getting the begging letters.

Just be aware of this slim possibility.

If it does happen, you would need to try and convince him that he is not liable for any charge, and neither are you, and that the correct advice is to simply ignore it, and ignore all the scary letters. The threats in the letters will not ever materialise, they are there simply to scare you/your Dad into paying up without questioning the legality of the charge.

SNAP - more or less said the same thing at the same time.

Hopefully some reassurance in that OP!

5t.

Stephen_Leak

The entire parking ticket is wrong, not just the registration number.

Firstly, the legal stuff.

Only councils, the police, train operators and Transport for London can impose legally enforceable fines or penalties. A private parking company (PPC) or an individual can't. Even PPCs call their tickets “Parking Charge Notices”, not “Penalty Charge Notices”. In law, they’re called “speculative invoices”.

Any warning signs are usually so badly positioned and worded, that they won’t have created a fair and legally binding deemed contract between the car park owner and a driver entering the car park in the first place. See The Unfair Contract Terms Act 1997 and Excel Parking Services vs. Cutts, Stockport, 2011.

All the car park owner (CPO) can claim from a driver in damages for any breach of contract is what they’ve lost as a result. If this is a free car park or they paid, this is £0.00. Demanding more has been judged to be unreasonable and therefore an unfair contract penalty under the terms of The Unfair Contract Terms Act 1997, which is not legally enforceable. See Dunlop Pneumatic Tyre Co. Ltd. vs. New Garage & Motor Co. Ltd., House of Lords, 1914 and countless cases since.

There are also now two recent court cases, VCS Parking Control vs. Ronald Ibbotson, S!!!!horpe, 2012 and VCS Parking Control vs. HM Revenue & Customs, Upper Tax Tribunal, 2012. In both cases, the judges found that only the car park owner can take drivers to court. The Upper Tax Tribunal is a court of record, equivalent to the High Court, and therefore its judgement sets a legal precedent.

What should I do now?

We don’t condone not paying or overstaying in a pay car park. If you do owe the CPO anything, then you ought to write to them, offering this in “full and final settlement”.

In any event, you ought to advise the CPO that they are "jointly and severally liable" for the actions of their agents, the PPC, and that any further actions by them would be regarded as harassment under the terms of The Protection from Harassment Act 1997. That ought to make the CPO call off the PPC and, hopefully, realise the potential cost of doing business with them.

Don’t appeal to the PPC. They always reject them. What’s in it for them to let anyone off? Actually, there is something in it for them: information. They need to know the identity of the driver of the vehicle involved at the time, because that’s who the alleged contract was with. If they don’t know who the driver was, they have to make do with chasing the registered keeper.

With windscreen notices, an appeal letter will tell them your name and address, and maybe who was driving at the time. If they don’t know who the driver was, they have to buy the details of registered keeper from the DVLA. With postal notices, they’ve done this already. But they still need to know the identity of the driver.

They sometimes say that they have the right to ask for this information. This doesn’t mean that you have to tell them.

However, even if you’ve written and told them who the driver was, it doesn’t make their actions any less unlawful. It just means that instead of harassing the registered keeper, they can now harass the driver.

What will they do to me?

The PPC, then a debt collector and then a solicitor will send you a series of letters. The debt collector and solicitor are usually also the PPC, but using different headed paper. These letters will threaten you with every kind of financial and legal unpleasantness imaginable, to intimidate you into paying.

But, they can't actually do anything, for the same reason that a Nigerian e-mail scammer couldn't sue anyone who didn’t pay them.

What should I do then?

Continue to ignore everything you get from the PPC and their aliases. It does seem counter-intuitive to deal with something by ignoring it. Eventually, they will run out of empty threats, and stop throwing good money after bad.

ManxRed

fivetide wrote: »

SNAP - more or less said the same thing at the same time.

Hopefully some reassurance in that OP!

5t.

Must.... learn..... to..... type.... quicker!

shan7-8-6

Lol great responses and thanks for the replies, if the car was registered to me, the letters would not bother me at all, I'd just bin them! But its my dads, he's 74 and he's especially annoyed since I have other ongoing problems (check my other thread, someone is making a claim against me which means I might have to go bankrupt) so I may just have to pay it, he's already under enough stress because of me.

Stephen_Leak

OK. Let's customise things to your particular circumstances.

Write to the PPC and tell them you were the driver. They should then their letters sent to you. One problem with Dad sorted.

Then, you can ignore them. No money to the PPC.

Since VCS Parking Control vs. Ronald Ibbotson and VCS Parking Control vs. HM Revenue & Customs, PPCs can't even take drivers to court.

shan7-8-6

Stephen_Leak wrote: »

OK. Let's customise things to your particular circumstances.

Write to the PPC and tell them you were the driver. They should then their letters sent to you. One problem with Dad sorted.

Then, you can ignore them. No money to PPC.

Since VCS Parking Control vs. Ronald Ibbotson and VCS Parking Control vs. HM Revenue & Customs, PPCs can't even take drivers to court.

I was parked in a disabled bay (I don't hold a badge) but it was like 9.15pm, the gym closes at 10pm and there were like 6 other empty disabled bays (there were only around 10 cars in the whole car park) I only parked there because it was raining so badly that I didn't want to get drenched before I'd even got into the gym. Would that count against me? Or have any consequence?