Help with Huge Elec Bill

lazyjack

Hi,

Hoping for a bit (lot) of advice here. My elderly mother-in-law has just advised that she had a huge Electricity bill recently of £2k for the last 10.5 months (unfortunately she only told me after the DD payment went out).

Anyway, it seems she was contacted by phone about 12 months ago by EDF, advising they could offer her a better deal, which she went ahead with. No bills in the meantime, meter gets read on June 11th then the bill arrives a few weeks later.

Economy 7 meter, the bill states usage of 19000kwh (day) and 1500kwh (night). To me this seems almost impossible, I've just done a reading and in the last 4 weeks the usage is 88 and 119 respectively (I appreciate we are not in winter).

My initial suspicions are either:

1. Readings are mixed up (prob not the case)
2. Meter is dodgy (prob not the case)
3. The meter reading at the transfer date was completely wrong (my theory)

What I am starting to think is that the usage is a build up of many years of underpayment, which has gone unnoticed as the meter does not appear to have been read by the previous supplier (BG) for a long time (all paperwork I've looked at shows estimate readings).

Now what worries me is that on the recent bill it shows the reading from last year as C (customer) but this is not correct. It would appear that EDF have simply estimated/guessed the figure and applied it to the transfer paperwork. Now if this is the case, how could they have offered a better deal if they did not have accurate info ?

Also, do the suppliers themselves have any sort of liability ? On the old BG paperwork it says they aim to read the meter every 3 months to ensure payments keep up with usage. On EDF website it says they will review twice a year, which has not happened either.

Sorry for the long post, any advice would be welcomed.

spiro

A few points:

1) The meter should be read every 2 years but this resets on change of supplier
2) BGs t&c say you should submit meter reading twice a year, other suppliers may say the same.
3) The consumption is completely wrong if you are on a E7 tariff, you need to be using something like 60%+ at night and the rest during the day, your figures show 92% being used in the day. This implies that either you mother is using the heating a lot in the day or the reading are transposed. Have you check the day register is moving during the day?
4) Regarding the C reading, did they phone her around the CoS date to request readings?

jalexa

lazyjack wrote: »

Sorry for the long post, any advice would be welcomed.

On the face of it the situation is unsatisfactory and your "almost impossible" suspicion is perfectly reasonable.

Firstly some general advice. A customer is entitled to raise a formal complaint on the first occasion a supplier does not deal with an issue 100% to the customer's satisfaction. Having done that if the customer remains dissatisfied on "deadlock" or after 8 weeks, whichever occurs first, the issue can be referred to the Energy Ombudsman. Suppliers hate that.

Not sure why you think the readings are probably not transposed. I would say that was the first issue to determine accurately. Not necessarily easy to do as meters (and timeclocks) vary. Ideally post a photo or describe the meter best you can.

The start reading is not necessarily the big issue it may seem. The main issue to verify is that the previous supplier's closing reading(s) and the current supplier's opening reading(s) are identical.

The Edf tariff terms and conditions will specify the minimum billing frequency (for Edf could be as little as one per year). Are you saying your m-i-l was on a regular fixed monthly direct debit scheme, quarterly full bill direct debit or some other arrangement? Need an answer to that to determine if there has been supplier billing failure.

Cardew

IMO it is almost impossible to only use 7% at night(or conversely 93% at night) - so your assumption that the consumption figures are incorrect holds.

Does your mother-in-law have storage heating? and how does she heat water? The reading of 88/119kWh last week suggests an immersion heater for water? Given that hot water demand and 7 hours night consumption for fridges etc does not vary greatly throughout the year, that suggests a consumption of around 5,000kWh pa. for those items alone.

The crucial issue is what meter readings did BG use to close the account - and how were those meter readings obtained? estimated? Meter reader? Customer?

lazyjack

Many thanks for the replies. I'll try and answer a few things as best I can.

Spiro
1. Meter reading every 2 years, this does not appear to have happened. The oldest paperwork I can see from BG is 2006 and even this has estimated readings.
2. I will make sure I keep a close eye on the readings from now on and submit them on a regular basis.
3. I agree that E7 tariff is probably not the best for her. It was probably done as she has electric storage heaters (no gas). As my M-I-L is retired it's inevitable that she will use a huge percentage during the day, especially in winter.
4. I don't believe they called for readings as my M-I-L has no idea how to read the meter properly.

jalexa
My M-I-L is going to have a quick chat with her local Citizens Advice this morning, just to see what they advise. I will try and get a

photo of the meter ASAP but a very rough description would be black with digital display and a small button on the top left to cycle the rates, time, date etc. The only thing mentioned is 'Rate 1' and 'Rate 2' and I have checked the time which was correct. Regarding the 'start' reading, I have already asked her to contact BG this morning to establish what they have as a closing reading and where it came from. The direct debit seems to have been a regular fixed monthly direct debit scheme which may not have been reviewed on an ongoing basis.

Thanks again to both of you for the help so far.

lazyjack

Cardew wrote: »

IMO it is almost impossible to only use 7% at night(or conversely 93% at night) - so your assumption that the consumption figures are incorrect holds.

Does your mother-in-law have storage heating? and how does she heat water? The reading of 88/119kWh last week suggests an immersion heater for water? Given that hot water demand and 7 hours night consumption for fridges etc does not vary greatly throughout the year, that suggests a consumption of around 5,000kWh pa. for those items alone.

The crucial issue is what meter readings did BG use to close the account - and how were those meter readings obtained? estimated? Meter reader? Customer?

Sorry, was just replying to the others so missed your post initially. I will need to check for sure about water heating but it maybe an immersion (although she does have an oil supply too). Should also get an answer from BG this morning regarding the closing reading, which now seems vital to establish what's gone wrong.

spiro

What you need to check is the readings used on BGs closing bill match the EDF (they should) and see what reading type they say it is as it is the new supplier that produces the change of supplier read not the old supplier.

jalexa

lazyjack wrote: »

4. I don't believe they called for readings as my M-I-L has no idea how to read the meter properly.

Don't feel intimidated by unhelpful talk of having to read the meters. At the risk of being accused of "ageism", select any one of age, infirmity, eyesight, memory, awkward meter location etc etc.

Your m-i-l's supplier will have a care register. If there are any problems with providing a reading your m-i-l can register.

lazyjack

Well the latest is she had a very positive meeting with Citizens Advice, the person she dealt with has taken all the details and bills and is referring it to her supervisor in the main office.

In the meantime, I'll make sure we get the readings from BG so I can check they match up.

Also, thanks for the suggestion of the care register, I've just downloaded the application form.

Terrylw1

To rule out a current supplier period transposition, now you know which way round each of the rates is working, does your day/night match to your current bill? Does it match to your switch reading?

Now, do the readings you have just taken run inline with all the bills for Bgas? This rules out a supplier transposition that could affected the new supplier if you find their start read is the wrong way round.

Was there a meter change at any point in the bills you can see? Sometimes meter are installed on readings greater than zero but the readings go missing and the suppliers Data Collector sets a Deemed reading at zero. The supplier challenges this when they get a customer or visit read and see a large advance. Since they never get into this property, that would be missed.

The elec reading obligation is really poor and Ofgem can be blamed for that. Its not possible to regulate that obligation in a yearly or less churn market. They now how to resolve it, but are not doing so as it always takes the media, other body or customer pressure to make them wake up and do what they are payed for!

The switch reading is easy for me. If you didn't provide one, the new suppliers Data Collection Deems one. Its Deemed based on the previous consumption held by the old suppliers Data Collector. If they never get any reads, its very possible they only hold Estimated Annual Charges (EAC) which is a forecast of the next 12 months. If they never get in or get sent a read you submit to the supply, each year becomes an EAC. If the original EAC is too low, all the ones after will be as well.

This EAC is then passed to the new suppliers Data Collector, so the saga continues.

If they go 2 years without a read, the Data Collector has to create one purely per obligations and insert it at 12 months. Again, based on what they have so can easily be too low.

The Deemed switch read will be sent to both suppliers by their respective Data Collectors and it will show as Deemed instead of from a customer. So, they can very easily confirm that to you. It could be that a member of staff made a mistake. However, if both suppliers hold the same reading marked as C then something must have Bern sent but it could be that the new supplier made the mistake, so the old supplier just trusts them. Again, that's all produced via data flows between parties so their is a full electronic audit trail.

Do the opening and closing readings match, so their has been no "wind back" that would cause the opening reading to overlap thus paying for the energy twice. This cannot happen in the industry as the transfer is always to the same date & reading, but due to billing errors, it can sometimes happen in the bills hence requiring correction (it happens when several readings are going back and forth so each supplier ends up confused).

lazyjack

Thanks all for the help & advice. Have just PMd a link to the EDF bill to you so you can see all the details. Hope you don't mind.