Bad Road Design causes Bad Driving?

NBLondon

The two recent threads "Bad Driving" and "Driver in overtaking lane at 65mph" have both had posts where the design of the road or junction is possibly a contributing factor. In answering one of the posts I found this website listing badly designed junctions.

A bad road layout can confuse people. Or it can cause locals to make their own unofficial rules (e.g. which lane to use) and thus confuse visitors. Or it can just be plain dangerous. I'm sure I've examples mentioned in other threads - so how common do you think it is?

gilbert_and_sullivan

The classic one is the M6/M1/A14 junction when leaving M6 and joining A14 Eastbound.

Traffic builds right back onto the M6, especially during Friday afternoons, umpteen people have been seriously hurt here over the years and i believe some killed.

The junction narrows to a single lane as it passes under the M1 with traffic lights at either side creating a terrible bottleneck...clearly unless someone was mentally impaired it was easily forseen that such a major trunk route would carry a massive amount of traffic, apparently common sense isn't part of the planners job requirements.

Unbelievably bad design, whoever was responsible for it should be imprisoned and every time some poor blighter perishes or gets seriously hurt there, the designer should be prosecuted for neglect and more time added to the sentence....pipe dream, as in practice the designer was probably given a knighthood, golden handshake and index linked pension and as we speak is relaxing in comfort being fanned and waited on hand and foot.

Oh and as for bad driving, the design of the above junction causes those who wish do die early to cruise slowly down the middle lane, M1 only, and then to stop in the carriageway and force their way in to the queue, sometimes they don't make it as they cleaned up by a 44 tonner doing 55 mph...mor eoften though their selfish actions causes heavy braking and several hundred yards behind some poor blighter gets seriously hurt...as is so often the case the swine who caused it all swans off into the sunset...''never had an accident you know''....

Rolandtheroadie

I'm sure Motorcycle News done an article a year or 2 ago about a junction that was littered with signs and had a fair few accidents at it.

Road was decluttered and the accident rate dropped.

SailorSam

I hate driving on Motorways that i don't know.
I think the people i feel most sorry for are those on two wheels, the poor cyclist has no chance.

Throbbe

NBLondon wrote: »

In answering one of the posts I found this website listing badly designed junctions.

Nice link. I actually drive through several of those on my daily commute. While I'm doing something else at the moment I am usually a highway designer. Feel free to appreciate the irony.

If g&s could indicate exactly where I apply for my knighthood, golden handshake and index linked pension I'd be grateful as I seem to have missed that memo.

Debt_Free_Chick

NBLondon wrote: »

The two recent threads "Bad Driving" and "Driver in overtaking lane at 65mph" have both had posts where the design of the road or junction is possibly a contributing factor. In answering one of the posts I found this website listing badly designed junctions.

A bad road layout can confuse people. Or it can cause locals to make their own unofficial rules (e.g. which lane to use) and thus confuse visitors. Or it can just be plain dangerous. I'm sure I've examples mentioned in other threads - so how common do you think it is?

It's an interesting concept and one that I think has some (not insubstantial) merit.

There's a similar argument regarding speeding - that signs do nothing to change behaviour as drivers' will go at the speed that the layout allows. So putting a 40 mph sign on a mile long stretch of straight road with great visibility will achieve .... absolutely bu88er all! Similarly, putting a "national limit" on a winding country lane will not have drivers upping the speed at which they drive.

Dave_C_2

The ones that get me are junctions where there is an entry slip road for traffic joining a motorway (or dual carriageway) quickly followed by an exit slip road for traffic leaving the motorway. Then some fool decides that it's a good idea to join them up.

On the joined up bit there is guaranteed to be traffic leaving and joining the motorway on the same bit of road at the same time. Add into this mix drivers changing lanes on the motorway at the last minute to turn off and accidents are guaranteed.

Dave

Indout96

We have a slip road coming off Bolton Road joining the main 3 lane carrageway in bradford which is controled by traffic lights as its a an accute angle.
http://goo.gl/maps/c9De
Now this would be fine BUT the lights are constant and the lights on the carrageway alter depending on the time of day so there are times when both are red and also when both are green. Fine if you travel it every day but not if you are on it for the first time and both turn green together.

pulliptears

I'd say more of a contribution than a cause, but I do agree. I posted earlier about this in the other thread which, because I'm inherently lazy, I'll just copy and paste here

This slip road not far from my home has an average of an accident once a week. Its always rear end shunts.

https://maps.google.co.uk/maps?q=mei...12,317.95,,0,0

In fairness its a poor design. The wall to the right means your visibility is poor until you have literally yards left causing many a driver to slam on the brakes at the end of the slip, in turn causing rear end shunts. Whenever I use this particular slip I always leave a larger than usual gap to allow for it.

Now, on the other side of that tunnel is another slip:

https://maps.google.co.uk/maps?q=mei...=12,97.53,,0,0

Now that one looks perfect, look behind and you can see a long, straight slip road with excellent visibility onto the A50, merging in is easy. But.. look where the coach is. Barely a hundred yards in front of the slip road is an exit for a service station which also houses a coach depot. This means you come down the slip road and can merge at 50mph with relative ease but then often find yourself having to rapidly stop because a coach is turning at 10mph into the depot. This has also caused many rear end shunts.

To me, your average driver not roadplanner, it seems that both of these slip roads were given little thought.

forgotmyname

Shame its only junctions listed.

What about the A38 into Birmingham, Dual carriageway opens to 3 lanes at each set of lights for about 100 - 200ft yards each time.

So every set of lights is a grand prix with horns blaring and exhanges of paint.

Or a bit further out they changed the lines on a roundabout about 6 times at £13,000 a time.
Must be expensive paint they use.

SHIPSHAPE

Debt_Free_Chick wrote: »

It's an interesting concept and one that I think has some (not insubstantial) merit.

There's a similar argument regarding speeding - that signs do nothing to change behaviour as drivers' will go at the speed that the layout allows.

Sounds like a rubbish argument then.

Regardless of what the layout is, if it is signed, at say 40mph, then one should drive at, or below, that speed.

Driver's behaviour is (for some of us) determined by the speed limit, not how nice and pretty some particular drive is.

If they cannot grasp this fundemental basic of driving then they shouldn't be driving in the first place.


So putting a 40 mph sign on a mile long stretch of straight road with great visibility will achieve .... absolutely bu88er all!

Yes it will, it will (hopefully) achieve punishment of drivers who are too thick to recognise a sign they should adhere to.




Similarly, putting a "national limit" on a winding country lane will not have drivers upping the speed at which they drive.

Why on earth would any driver 'up' their speed to 60mph on, your own words, 'a winding country lane' when it may be more appropriate to drive, safely, lower than 60mph on this obviously challenging road?

I despair at some motorists!:eek: